Not So Vanilla Werewolf Diffusion

[gabe]

there is a small group of players I think are confirmed villagers. I'm not posting them so I don't get played by them until at least day 2

[Hoopy]

Ok so I don't think we should lynch Ong today. Reason being that if he's actually N1 seer then the wolves are left with a tough choice of whether to let him have a lookup or risk a kill knowing there could be a N1 angel.

[Hoopy]

I don't think that Ong and JV can both be wolves, the tones of their arguments seem too difficult to fake if that makes sense.

[Hoopy]

meanwhile daven is going afk. last time he did a big afk he was a wolf. I don't buy it when people who use the Internet give an excuse for not using the Internet for days

also I still am trying to bink it on the rong soulread

lets hang rong or daven

Gabe your reason for wanting daven dead seems to be "he was afk once as a wolf for a legit reason so this time he must be a wolf as well", how does that work?

[Luco]

half hour for lunch gogogogogo

[Luco]

Also, seeing as imsavy posted, it's not unreasonable for even a wolf to think he might be playing.

Yeah I guess

I would love to hear why you have gabe and luco on your villager list. Gabe doesn't seem like Gabe to me this game. He jumped on Rong VERY early and other than his last post hasn't really provided much info imo.

And Luco just has the argument against you. If you are a villager why does that one act make him a villager?

I didn't like the attack. It's like gabe got a raging hardon for rong when all I got was a little chubby

So me flipping wolf with clear lots of people and nail jyms.

Ok jack, explain slowly why I am a wolf, because right now it seems you're pushing hard for the lynch of someone based on someone else's flawed logic. You're going to quite some lengths here... you're trying to sell it to the village based on the massive amount of info we get if I flip wolf. But jack, what info does the village get when I flip villager? You haven't even considered that because you're motive is to get a strong villager lynched.

You're way too aggressive here, this makes no sense for jack villager. I can't even ask you to explain slowly why you think I'm a wolf because you don't even know, you're building the case based on potential info we get, rather than ong is a wolf because blah.

FYI jack's last wolf game was painfully careful and neutral, nothing like this at all

I'm on 5 votes.

Guys I'm a n1 seer. If we have a n1 angel, don't out, just protect me. I'll have a wolf tomorrow. If I get nommed, then jack and bigred all day long. Last one could be anyone.

rescind ong

wow, this took off.

Need to catch up, only scanned so far.

But Ong, if you'd said anything but n1 seer I'd be inclined to believe you more.

This.

Also, if he does flip wolf, you heard it here first!

Stahp with teh YHIHF pls

rescind ong

I don't think wuf's post disproved the argument at all btw (and one might wonder why wuf would step in to vouch for a villager in the first place), and this outing as n1 seer is a bit convenient given the situation and a game made to facilitate fake outs. Ong does have the kind of enthusiasm over him that's only ever consistent with him being a wolf or an important villager so I've rescinded to mull it over some more. I have one question for you though ong:


Do you actually believe stuff like this, because these are some specifics that make me very suspicious. It's an argument that has been used in the past but if I think back to all the past games, then I have to conclude that no wolves actually do this. What wolf ever stepped up to try and get a very vocal and strong villager lynched?

Yeah I agree that on a fundamental level wuf's post didn't alter the argument. I do wonder on what his posts mean for Ong (and BID's) role(s) though.

You'll need to lynch me first anyway if I'm not trusted, because if I'm a fucked wolf, there's the risk I try to take a strong villager down in jack. So tomorrow, I post my lookup and then I get lynched. Easy.

I'm really, really interested in tomorrow now.

jkds

ong
rong
jv
gator
jyms
bid
bigred
luco
hoop
gabe
daven
keith


i can only vote for rong, jyms, bigred, keith, daven.

fwiw last time daven did an extended AFK he was a wolf (WW 2013 game). he had real reasons, but maybe subconciously he wouldnt do this as a villager? like if he was a wolf, he uses the convenient excuse of not checking the internet, but when hes hunting, he always takes the time to check the thread.

WTF is this, he said in the signup thread he'd be AFK. That's BEFORE he got his role.

I don't think that Ong and JV can both be wolves, the tones of their arguments seem too difficult to fake if that makes sense.

Yeah this is pretty clear.

[Luco]

I've run over and am seriously late for a meeting so

lynch gabe

Because I disagree about daven and I think he pushed his rong argument too hard. Will be back on after werk

[Luco]

Although he makes a good point about bigred and jyms re being wolfy so idk

[bigred]

I've run over and am seriously late for a meeting so

lynch gabe

Because I disagree about daven and I think he pushed his rong argument too hard. Will be back on after werk

I agree with this except I'm very hesitant to bold Gabe this early in the game.

[jyms]

Sorry guys, I'm Back. Gimme a few minutes to catch up.

[jyms]

Ok you read it hear first after Bigred said it (he always says it). Gator is a wolf. His tone and posting style is different than I ever remember

I mirrored gabe as I said, I think gabe has strong soul reads and has done it many times. He also ends uo dead long before we realize it.

Ong is Ong, and usually he's a wolf while being Ong. As a villager he posts just as much but becomes fixated on one person.

Daven is almost a wolf, and again gabe's argument is a good one.

JV will require more time before I call him out. And as always there is one person at least we have no idea of, that will take time.
Lynch gator

[OngBonga]

Slight change of tac here ong.

"What's actually gonna happen tomorrow is I'm gonna give a guilty report on jack and then the village are gonna have to decide which one of us to lynch first."

Well think about it. Tomorrow, I post "lol yeah jack's a wolf" and then what, the village default lynch me? I would *prefer* it if the confirmed wolf got killed first, obviously. And it is a decision for the village. If I die first, well that's tough luck for me, but then when I flip jack gets killed next day. The reason it's a decision for the village is because maybe I can be left, which makes life tougher for the wolves, because they'll be down one and will be faced with a village who might find some trust in me, forcing them to nom someone whose power is used up.

If I clear jack tomorrow, then you can't be sure jack is a villager until I die. It would make sense to just lynch me tomorrow in that event, because the wolves won't be in any hurry to nom me and my continued presence will be a distraction.

So jack = villager, and I get lynched.
Jack = wolf and we at least have a discussion.

Default lynching me after I give a guilty of jack would be reckless. It wouldn't bother me anywhere near as much as getting lynched today though, I'd at least understand that village aren't making a horrible mistake.

[bigred]

Saying who you will lookup is stupid for a number of reasons. I realize you're just responding to rong, but just stating the obvious.

[OngBonga]

lol for a start, it's already pretty obvious who I'm looking up.

2nd, maybe I'm fucking with the wolves and I'm actually gonna look you up.

[Keith]

#126

i'll need to think more on the night 1 angel outing. Interesting points you raise here. I still think there are benefits to be had from it though. I mean, if someone is say night 4 seer then they are not that likely to make it to endgame anyway, so it's not such a problem if they get nommed right? or maybe? hmm, like i said, gotta think more about this

#130

night one seer can't out without knowing there is a night one angel
that's why i suggested night one angel outs first
make sense?
then again, there's a pretty low chance that the wolf will actually hit the night one seer cos lol-probability, so maybe this plan becomes more useful on later days.

I don't see the point that Daven is trying to make here. I don't see how angel and/or seer outing benefits the village at all so why even suggestit. I can see how it could benefit wolves to fake claim angel and/or seer then reveal another wolfor even a villager to gain credibility and explain why they weren't targetted by the wolves.Could the argument that daven was having with Ong have been staged to set up these sort of claims.
I particularly don't like the fact that ong is now suggesting that we have to decide whether or not to lynch him before his lookup. I think its irrelevent as he agreed with my suggestion that ONG should definitely be tomorrows lynch to see if we could trust his lookup.
Also Ong was stating that people forced to out shouldn't reveal when they should act then puts himself as the n1 seer.I'm staying on Daven as he does not strike me as a villager the way he is acting and his suggestions seem to benefit the wolves more than the village.

[Keith]

also meant to point out that if someone outs as the n1 angel, n1 seer doesn't know whether thats a wolf fake outing so can't reliably out themselves.Or they could be taking a punt on a real night1 angel protecting the n1 seer and the fake angel claiming credit if the n1seer is saved or that they protected themselves if the n1 seer is eaten.It reeks of wolf den plans being put into action to me.

[Hoopy]

About 24hrs left.

@wufmod
Can we get a vote count please?

[OngBonga]

I particularly don't like the fact that ong is now suggesting that we have to decide whether or not to lynch him before his lookup.

I'm just saying how it is if I get a wolf report.

[bigred]

Back to lynch daven I suppose. Slightly better choice than Gator imo

[Keith]

I'm just saying how it is if I get a wolf report.

what happened to lynching you to prove that we could trust your report.

[JKDS]

I just finished a bunch of work. Im catching up now

[rong]

Ong, you sure are shifty.

[jackvance]

Ong probably wouldn't be this stubborn if he was a wolf, if I remove him from the wolf list this leaves Daven who is doing his wolfy huge quotes and being gone for actual content thing, rong is doing his wolfy considerate thoughtfullness. Luco villager, bigred villager, gabe villager. Jyms and gator are still question marks.

lynch daven

[OngBonga]

what happened to lynching you to prove that we could trust your report.

From my pov, that's the second best option, assuming I have a wolf report. But I'm expecting to go tomorrow whatever my report.

Rong of course I'm shifty. Everyone's on my case because you all seem to think that n1 seer is a viable wolf fakeclaim. Maybe I wasn't expecting that. It's pretty obvious that I'm not gonna survive to day 6. So to be quite frank I don't care if I'm shifty.

[GatorJH]

I will rescind bigred since obviously he is now this huge asset to the village.

As for Daven, the last game I did the same thing he is doing now (commenting on individual posts vs entire thread) because I was in a hurry and didn't want to draw attention by not posting, but he is contributing quite a bit so I don't see myself voting for him today.

As for jyms, he made minimal posts then jumps in with this.

Ok you read it hear first after Bigred said it (he always says it). Gator is a wolf. His tone and posting style is different than I ever remember

I mirrored gabe as I said, I think gabe has strong soul reads and has done it many times. He also ends uo dead long before we realize it.

Ong is Ong, and usually he's a wolf while being Ong. As a villager he posts just as much but becomes fixated on one person.

Daven is almost a wolf, and again gabe's argument is a good one.

JV will require more time before I call him out. And as always there is one person at least we have no idea of, that will take time.
Lynch gator

He parrots a couple of thoughts, throws in a couple of additional random thoughts that don't really mean anything and then votes for me. He always looks wolfish to me, but those warning bells are going bonkers this game.

lynch jyms

[gabe]

Gabe your reason for wanting daven dead seems to be "he was afk once as a wolf for a legit reason so this time he must be a wolf as well", how does that work?

I've run over and am seriously late for a meeting so

lynch gabe

Because I disagree about daven and I think he pushed his rong argument too hard. Will be back on after werk

the point about daven is not because he is going afk (even if he announced this, which i failed to notice), but because he is using that excuse to be away from the game for an extended period.

im going to vote for him since no one wants to kill rong
rescind
lynch daven

[GatorJH]

I could also jump on a rong bandwagon pretty quickly if it takes off. I just read his posts and they either a)talk about game mechanics or b)don't have much content. He doesn't seem to be putting much effort into finding wolves.

[JKDS]

Fuck, I cant tell with ong anymore. Villager? I think??? Whats making this hard is that he's done a few things that I could totally see him do as a wolf. Maybe I'm just leveling myself here.

[JKDS]

lol yeah bigred and jack for sure

gator, I think luco's attack on me is sincere, I said so. I also said that I think he's right about daven. Hence my rescind. bigred then jumps on my wagon all lolol because what, I changed my mind about daven based on information?

As for gabe, I think he's a villager. It's obviously too early to say so with any certainty, I can only remember gabe being wolf once before and I thought he was a wolf so I feel like I can read gabe. No problem putting him in my village camp for now.

Like this one ^. I remember wolf ong going ballistic and throwing out reads on everyone and attacking everyone that attacked him as a wolf before.

So me flipping wolf with clear lots of people and nail jyms.

Ok jack, explain slowly why I am a wolf, because right now it seems you're pushing hard for the lynch of someone based on someone else's flawed logic. You're going to quite some lengths here... you're trying to sell it to the village based on the massive amount of info we get if I flip wolf. But jack, what info does the village get when I flip villager? You haven't even considered that because you're motive is to get a strong villager lynched.

You're way too aggressive here, this makes no sense for jack villager. I can't even ask you to explain slowly why you think I'm a wolf because you don't even know, you're building the case based on potential info we get, rather than ong is a wolf because blah.

And in this one ^ he seems pissed off and cornered. I mean, if his claim is true then I can see why he would be mad about getting votes...its essentially a sign he fucked up. So it makes sense both ways.

Ok so you think that I actually think you're a wolf after one post? Haven't people learned by now? Page one votes from me are almost exclusively random votes, and the purpose is to reaction test both you and anyone else who feels like chiming in, or maybe to simply amuse myself. So my soulread #1 was not entirely serious. I do think you're a wolf though jack thanks to your attack on me.

And you've pretty much confirmed it by not dropping your vote after wuf's post.

Luco's case on me just collapsed, but of course you didn't notice that, because your focus is to get a strong villager lynched.

But this one seems like a lie. His attack on Jack seemed sincere to me; maybe not a 100% confident read but his posts indicated he at least thought jack was wolfier than most players. This wasnt just a reaction test with no teeth behind it, ong thought (and still thinks) that JV is a wolf.

This is a desperate defense, and he outed shortly after. What i'm struggling with is if Ong would really feel this desperation just because hes a n1 seer or if it makes more sense that hes just a wolf.

n5 seer is the dodgiest claim because it's basically begging the town to not lynch until day 6, which will be final day.

This post doesnt matter though. 1), everyone is gonna claim something before they die. We cant just stop lynching because someone claimed. 2) idk if I can believe you no matter what role you are. You stated already that people should lie about their role (angel/seer) and also their night. I have no reason to think you wouldnt follow this and just claim seer n1 to get another day.

This is tough, and I dont think its gonna get better. I dont think he can stay alive past tomorrow, but i dont think we lose much by just waiting. I vote wait.

[JKDS]

The more I think about it the more I like it. My first post is pretty normal thinking after just read the role PM isn't it? The fact that ong thought this was wolfy means he didn't think like this, probably because he never got a villager PM. Especially with the comparison Luco makes. It would be hilarious to nail a wolf on one of his first posts like this. But there is more, it would also provide hoopy, daven, keith and luco with some villager cred if ong flips wolf. Solid lynch right there.

Why did you need Luco's post to think this? I dont get why your first thought wasnt "I was just quoting the pm" when ong attacked you.

When he was a wolf sure.

Ong is always erratic though. Hes being pretty defensive, but his villager game is usually very spontaneous whereas his wolf game hes very passive and sheepy.

Why does Ong think daven is a villager? Didn't he bold him?

So

We can't lynch you today, but that is the most ridiculous statement ever given the below statement in the intro.

Makes sense, because I read it as a joke :/

Have to agree. It's almost like he isn't thinking like a villager would.

Or its a joke? I dont get why you immediately go to this conclusion. Im thinking that you're just looking for anything to throw onto Ong's fire here.

[JKDS]

Nah, I think ong's a villager. Theres too many attacks against him that seem contrived and bandwagony, especially after wuf killed luco's argument and he outed. I get the confusion, but my gut is to slow down and work it out not push harder.

[OngBonga]

jkds, my page 1 attack on jack was kind of sincere in that his post pinged, but it's a reaction test because even I don't have that much faith in a read that I got from one post.

And for some reason I'm disappointed that you read me as villager. I'd rather you be wrong so you doubt your reads on me when I'm a wolf. Wanker.

[JKDS]

Oh I forgot! Luco is almost always a villager here. I cant see a wolf ever putting himself out there so much on day 1 with seers aplenty and pulling that much attention. I dont think a wolf would attack ong and gabe on the same day, and I dont think wolf luco woudl be so quick to step on gabe's toes after he got owned last game by him.

[wufwugy]

gabe - daven
gator - jyms
jv - daven
bigred - daven
jyms - gator
luco - gabe
daven - jyms
ong - jv
hoop - jyms
keith - daven
jkds - jyms

no vote - rong, bid

daven - 4
jyms - 4
gator - 1
gabe - 1
jv - 1

Day 1 over in about 22 hours and 4 minutes

[OngBonga]

well jyms > daven based on those who voted for daven with me

lynch jyms

[Luco]

the point about daven is not because he is going afk (even if he announced this, which i failed to notice), but because he is using that excuse to be away from the game for an extended period.

Ok you might have missed it but pretty sure he said 4 days in signup. I do get what you're saying but I don't think it's indicative.

Meh, I'm not sold on your lynch. You're a puzzle that should resolve itself soon enough.

Need sleep. Less focus on ong pls.

[wufwugy]

FYI, just like I always do, votes will only count on or before 2:00 PM PST. So anything 2:01 and beyond won't count.

Also make sure you want your vote where I said it is in my update. I will use my updates for future references instead of going back over the whole game day, so if my updates are wrong then the final tally will be wrong

[BankItDrew]

Sorry I've been not participating. Had quite the epic weekend.
1)

I like keith as a villager again this game. Hoopy too.

I always find that wolves tend to state players who are not wolves, rather than bold players they think are wolves. This quote is wolfy to me.
2)

It's explained in the link that wuf edited into the first post.

1/3rd chance of a 4/6, 5/5 or 6/4 split of seer/angel
The Mod then randomises a number from 1-5 for each town player. This is the one night that the players' role works on.

So we can have something like seers for night 2, 2, 4, 5 and angels 1, 1, 3, 4, 4, 4 just to make up something random. So there can be multiple look-ups and protects per night, or none.

Most wolves don't go into this sort of positive strat in favour of the village. Seems legit to me.
3)
daven and ong are not both wolves this game. Their bickering back and forth has conivinced me of this. If you're both wolves, all the power to ya.

4) First soul-read: gabe is a wolf.
5) Second soul-read: bigred is a wolf. Dude auto jumped on the ong wagon minutes after JV jumped on. My eyes on you guy.
6) I really don't think ong is a wolf. He's extremely active (I know this is sorta normal), and he's asked a few times for players to slowly explain why they think he is a wolf. If I was a wolf, I wouldn't be asking for this.
7) I believe ong is not a wolf. My #6 post was written before he outed himself as n1 seer and this just reinforces my suspicions.
8) Soul-read #3: Luco is a villager. mainly because he thinks the same as me re: gabe.

[gabe]

I could also jump on a rong bandwagon pretty quickly if it takes off. I just read his posts and they either a)talk about game mechanics or b)don't have much content. He doesn't seem to be putting much effort into finding wolves.

cool I'm glad someone else is with it. people think rong plays well, so if we gonna catch him as a wolf then this is how it's gonna be

daven is a meh lynch to me after luco confirms he said 4 days afk earlier (been on phone just briefly today so didn't check back)

we definitely can't do anything with ong now. we just wait for tomorrow

rescind and lynch rong

[gabe]

lots of people can state why they are likely a villager but I don't think rong can

[gabe]

BID is in opposite world. probably a villager lol

[BankItDrew]

BID is in opposite world. probably a villager lol

There ain't no probably about it. I am most certainly a villager this game.

[gabe]

ok

fwiw if I thought the village was lynching a villager I would defend that player. I'm not sure about jyms so he can hang but I have no reason to believe he's more of a wolf than 3/13

[OngBonga]

I agree with you gabe. jyms hasn't done anything to convince me he's a villager, and seeing as bigred and jack do not seem to be acceptable targets, I'm stuck there. Dan is in the same place as jyms, only I feel dan's wolfhunting record is stronger than jyms' and as such it's jyms if rong is the alternative.

daven got into my villager camp by getting wagonned by bigred and jack. I won't be reassessing daven until I find out the alignment of one of those two.

[GatorJH]

Ong, what are your thoughts on Rong?

[gabe]

look at all of us hunting wolves, trying to get to the bottom of this. who isnt doing this? rong, jyms, keith, bigred come to mind

[OngBonga]

I've no opinion regarding his alignment, if that's what you mean. I read through his posts yesterday and I could see where gabe was coming from. But I worry about removing such an asset on d1 without anything particularly compelling. I could say the same about jack, only I find the case on him compelling, and was pretty pleased to see JKDS post a string of dodgy posts that was bigred and jackvance heavy, suggesting I'm not alone in thinking they're both dodgy as fuck.

I'd say I'm in exactly the same place with you too gator. There's reason for concern, but I certainly don't want you gone first either. Removing players like dan, gator, jkds and gabe is a mistake, because when we mislynch, it's a huge bonus for the wolves. We should give them once chance at least to confirm them as villager by means of nom, rather than lynch.

[OngBonga]

^ @gator obv

[GatorJH]

I've no opinion regarding his alignment, if that's what you mean. I read through his posts yesterday and I could see where gabe was coming from. But I worry about removing such an asset on d1 without anything particularly compelling. I could say the same about jack, only I find the case on him compelling, and was pretty pleased to see JKDS post a string of dodgy posts that was bigred and jackvance heavy, suggesting I'm not alone in thinking they're both dodgy as fuck.

I'd say I'm in exactly the same place with you too gator. There's reason for concern, but I certainly don't want you gone first either. Removing players like dan, gator, jkds and gabe is a mistake, because when we mislynch, it's a huge bonus for the wolves. We should give them once chance at least to confirm them as villager by means of nom, rather than lynch.

So you don't think I have provided my own thoughts on why I think certain players are more villager or more wolf?

[jackvance]

Ong if you're actually a villager I'm gonna laugh at you for this huge display of what is essentially "they bolded me so they must be wolves".

[OngBonga]

So you don't think I have provided my own thoughts on why I think certain players are more villager or more wolf?

Did I say you didn't?

[OngBonga]

Ong if you're actually a villager I'm gonna laugh at you for this huge display of what is essentially "they bolded me so they must be wolves".

Yes jack, because that's my case on you. You bolded me. Meanwhile, luco is a lock villager because he bolded me.

[OngBonga]

I see through this jack. What you're doing there is stripping down my case to give the impression it's a revenge case. Your bold on me was highly opportunistic, just like your bold on daven. Luco's bold on me seemed sincere to me. That's the difference between you and luco.

[jackvance]

Yes it is all part of my masterplan and totally how I play as a wolf.

[OngBonga]

Yes you're opportunistic when you're wolf. And when you're villager, you don't jump on dodgy d1 cases, and you certainly don't continue to stay on that wagon after the case collapses. You take a more cautious approach as villager in early game, you're more passive than you have shown. I'm utterly convinced. The only note of caution is that I've been utterly convinced about you in the past, and you turned out to be the fucking vig. So while I think you're a wolf, I know that I could be wrong. I don't have a problem with that, it's no different to calling light because your range is loaded with bluffs. If you're once again villager, I'll have to accept that I really fucking suck at reading you.

[jackvance]

Fair enough. Prepare to be amazed then.

[OngBonga]

In fact you must be a wolf jack, simply because if you were a villager, you wouldn't be wasting your time arguing with me, because you'd know I was going to clear you tomorrow. You're on the defensive. If you were a villager, you'd be pleased with this situation, you'd be encouraging me to look you up.

Wolf.

All day long.

[BankItDrew]

ong was a super sick wolf two games ago and i really hope he's not one today. he's got me convinced.

lynch jackvance

[OngBonga]

So you don't think I have provided my own thoughts on why I think certain players are more villager or more wolf?

Right I see what you're getting at when I think about it.

When I say I'm in exactly the same place with you, I mean that you've not done anything yet to earn villager points but I do not want you gone today, the same as my position with rong. Your game is far too balanced for your efforts to put you in my villager camp just yet. Sorry, you're a victim of your own success there, you're too respected to get villager points for acting villagery.

[OngBonga]

ong was a super sick wolf two games ago and i really hope he's not one today. he's got me convinced.

lynch jackvance

Atta boy.

Fuck it let's see if this can get going.

lynch jackvance

[OngBonga]

I really hope that the words "fucking ong" are plastered all over the den.

[JKDS]

Im game. Ive never been right about jyms in the past anyway.

rescind, lynch vancejack

[GatorJH]

Yes you're opportunistic when you're wolf. And when you're villager, you don't jump on dodgy d1 cases, and you certainly don't continue to stay on that wagon after the case collapses. You take a more cautious approach as villager in early game, you're more passive than you have shown. I'm utterly convinced. The only note of caution is that I've been utterly convinced about you in the past, and you turned out to be the fucking vig. So while I think you're a wolf, I know that I could be wrong. I don't have a problem with that, it's no different to calling light because your range is loaded with bluffs. If you're once again villager, I'll have to accept that I really fucking suck at reading you.

I would have to disagree with this. There have been plenty of instances where JV has had a raging hard on for someone in early games. I distinctly remember one game where I too absolutely thought he as a wolf because he focused in on one person too much. At this moment I have JV pretty solidly in my villager camp.

[GatorJH]

Right I see what you're getting at when I think about it.

When I say I'm in exactly the same place with you, I mean that you've not done anything yet to earn villager points but I do not want you gone today, the same as my position with rong. Your game is far too balanced for your efforts to put you in my villager camp just yet. Sorry, you're a victim of your own success there, you're too respected to get villager points for acting villagery.

I guess I can live with that compliment and at least you could see where I was coming from.

[BankItDrew]

I think gator is trying to earn villgery points for when jv flips village.

[OngBonga]

I would have to disagree with this. There have been plenty of instances where JV has had a raging hard on for someone in early games. I distinctly remember one game where I too absolutely thought he as a wolf because he focused in on one person too much. At this moment I have JV pretty solidly in my villager camp.

This may be the case. But tell me when jack has had a raging hard on for someone based on someone else's flawed case, and then refused to back down when that case collapses.

Why do you think he's a villager?

[OngBonga]

I think gator is trying to earn villgery points for when jv flips village.

This is more likely than both jack and gator being wolves.

[BankItDrew]

if jv flips vill i'm snap lynching gator

[jackvance]

I quite often go after people very enthusiastically while at other times I just can't decide on anyone. I don't think this is anything new for people who have played with me more often. Ask Keith.

[BankItDrew]

Keith? Care to chime in here?

[GatorJH]

I think gator is trying to earn villgery points for when jv flips village.

No, Gator just doesn't think JV is a wolf.

[OngBonga]

Gator, do you think that jack is behaving like someone who expects to be cleared tomorrow?

[GatorJH]

This may be the case. But tell me when jack has had a raging hard on for someone based on someone else's flawed case, and then refused to back down when that case collapses.

Why do you think he's a villager?

Because personally I don't think he has a raging hard on for you as much as you think he does. In fact, in one of his posts he points to your stubbornness as making you a villager more often than a wolf. Most of his posts related to you have been a response to YOUR posts about him. It also wasn't HIS logic that drove his first lynch of you, it was bigred's that he also noticed. Others also agreed with the logic and you were on your way to the gallows when you outed as the N1 seer.

Finally he also referenced a game where the two of you were wolves and you acted in a similar manner.

I won't vote jv today because I think there are much better options available and don't want to lynch someone on day 1 who is very good at finding wolves.

[GatorJH]

Gator, do you think that jack is behaving like someone who expects to be cleared tomorrow?

I think he is playing like someone who isn't afraid of being looked up and that speaks villager to me way more than wolf.

[gabe]

please don't follow ong. I'm starting think he's a wolf or he's not actually going to look up jack tonight

tomorrow well be more sure about that situation