COULD this be diff when....

...Hero Opens?

Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em Tournament, 60/120 Blinds (9 handed) - Full-Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

CO (t8240)
Button (t13976)
SB (t13358)
BB (t4290)
UTG (t7010)
UTG+1 (t1770)
MP1 (t6131)
MP2 (t2409)
Hero (MP3) (t5764)

Hero's M: 32.02

Preflop: Hero is MP3 with 10, A
4 folds, Hero calls t120, 1 fold, Button calls t120, SB calls t60, BB checks

Flop: (t480) 4, J, K (4 players)
SB bets t382, BB calls t382, Hero calls t382, Button raises to t1100, 2 folds, Hero calls t718

Turn: (t3444) A (2 players)
Hero checks, Button bets t3444, Hero raises to t4544 (All-In), Button calls t1100

River: (t12532) J (2 players, 1 all-in)

Total pot: t12532

Daily$ from a couple of days ago. Simple discussion, Is an opening raise here changing the dynamics of this pot? Hero had played some solid stuff, limped a couple of times with KAo/KAs. Villian was quite active but hadnt gone to showdown bar maybe 1 hand over a period of 90mins....

Hero 24.4/13.8/2.8
Villian(button) 32.3/12.9/2.0

Why are we open limping?

Why are we limping AKs, AKo? Why are you calling the flop raise with a gutter?

Stop limping and start raising. You accomplish several things by raising instead of limping. You take control of the hand and you prevent a lot of players from seeing the flop. In addition, when you raise and you are called, when they check you can c-bet a ton of missed flops and take it down.

Im never limping with AT in this position. Raise from here fold earlier. Can not believe you are limping with AKs/AKo what hand do you need to raise?
Open limping is something you do when making some sort of move I don't think it should be standard part of the game.

at least you can make arguments for pre flop, although my guess is they will fail.

flop calls are both disasters that cannot be defended, 3 clean outs and many cards than can get you in trouble.

Originally Posted by hopeful

Im never limping with AT in this position. Raise from here fold earlier.

I think opening ATo from this position pre-antes is marginal and not really +EV unless you have a big edge post-flop. Not to come across as too big of a jerk, but the OP looks like he plays worse than his opponents post-flop so he'd want to play a lot tighter pre-flop.

Basically, what sprayed, mcat, and dmrc said. This hand is a trainwreck. Suggestions:

Go here: http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...st-t36038.html

And read Harrington on Hold 'Em. your fundamentals are severely flawed.

I am asking given the way HERO played this post flop, IF HERO open raises to 3x or 4x do we still think HERO is going to follow the same kind of pattern again?

i don't think you're going about this right if you're ignoring the constructive advice that was posted by drmc, mcat, sprayed, etc. I know that wasn't what you were looking for in the first place, but this whole fucking hand was a trainwreck, and they're trying to help. And I'm not sure if hero is going to follow the same pattern if he opens for 3 or 4x in this spot (which is also bad, for what it's worth.). So I guess, hopefully not?

Originally Posted by Freeroller

I am asking given the way HERO played this post flop, IF HERO open raises to 3x or 4x do we still think HERO is going to follow the same kind of pattern again?

So you're basically asking us to tell you what you have done post flop, if you had raised preflop? I don't know what to tell you, none of us know what you were thinking when you called the flop raise with just a gutshot so who knows what would've been going through your head

This 'could' be different had you folded. THis could be different if anything was actually different about it.
Why would you open limp prior with AKs AKo and consider that as good play?
I honestly don't have a clue where to even start telling you any kind of advice on this hand.. or even more so.. on NLHE tourney-style poker. I can think of some advice in general for you though... READ Harrinton On Holdem Vol.1.... then read Vol.2 You might also want to try reading Phil Gordon's books (Little Green Book & Little BLue Book).
Your basic foundation here is so seriously flawed that any kind of comment on this one particular hand isn't going to help you out too much in my opinion.
I'm not trying to flame ya here..... it's just that I KNOW that if you read any or all of those books I mentioned, I'd guarantee your game would improve by at least 500%!!! (maybe even alot more).

... one question...how do you make the call on the flop here? (I know.. you click on the button that says 'call'.. but seriously?)
Read the books!! You might even be able to get them from your local library for free via an inter-library loan. If not, they are well worth evey penny spent on them.