I might be thinking too hard...

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10-08-2008, 12:40 PM
Numbr2intheWorld

I might be thinking too hard...

Villain is gith who i really haven't played much with lately but from a datamine i have him at 16/13/3 with 3-bet of 4%. I thought the call preflop is standard. I'm also really not sure whether he reacts to minraises by 3-betting more, less or the same.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $10.00 BB (6 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

SB ($945)
BB ($1255)
UTG ($2053)
MP ($1133)
CO ($1030)
Hero (Button) ($1192)

Preflop: Hero is Button with Qhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/spade.gif, Jhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/spade.gif
3 folds, Hero raises to $20, SB raises to $70, BB calls $60, Hero calls $50

Flop: ($210) 10http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif, 7http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif, Qhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif (3 players)
SB bets $140, 1 fold, Hero folds

Total pot: $210 | Rake: $3

I thought my problem here is that i'm rarely calling this flop with a strong hand against this sort of action, and that's what he probably assumes. I'm not gonna call a double barrel. So i thought my range was ridiculously exploitable and most players will take advantage. But is this illogical in position?

Also i considered that in itself his betting range is pretty damn strong.
10-08-2008, 12:51 PM
nutsinho

sexy
10-08-2008, 01:58 PM
griffey24

If we're folding on a Q high board, and we're folding to most double barrels then I'd rather just fold pre really. No harm in that to such a big nit?
10-08-2008, 02:32 PM
pocketfours

Quote:

Originally Posted by nutsinho

sexy
10-08-2008, 02:32 PM
Alexos

"Also i considered that in itself his betting range is pretty damn strong. "

Agree with this, I also am a firm believer that people do not think as deeply as you think they do, thus folding here and playing QJs this way is unexploitable vs 99% of regs.
10-08-2008, 02:37 PM
pocketfours

Re: I might be thinking too hard...

btw if flop was 9http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif, 8http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif, Qhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif, then I'd certainly play.
10-08-2008, 02:50 PM
griffey24

I mean.. I really don't get why people aren't just saying to muck this pre. The guy is a mega nit with a 3-bet % of 4! If a lot of money gets in on any J high or Q high flop, we're never happy about it.

The only flops that we like are like 9Tx or like spades. Even KT probably isn't great, as he'll prob have a piece that likes it and have little fold equity anyhow.

meh.. I don't know... maybe I just fold to too many 3bets...
10-08-2008, 08:47 PM
mixchange

G, cuz a lot of mega nits still like to 3bet a lot in the blinds and then play like a nit post flop
10-09-2008, 01:01 AM
IowaSkinsFan

I think he's a lot more aggro then that.
10-09-2008, 05:16 AM
pocketfours

Quote:

Originally Posted by griffey24

I mean.. I really don't get why people aren't just saying to muck this pre. The guy is a mega nit with a 3-bet % of 4! If a lot of money gets in on any J high or Q high flop, we're never happy about it.

The only flops that we like are like 9Tx or like spades. Even KT probably isn't great, as he'll prob have a piece that likes it and have little fold equity anyhow.

meh.. I don't know... maybe I just fold to too many 3bets...

Getting huge pot odds for playing in position against predictable opponents with a hand that plays well in multiway pots. I don't mind a fold, but I certainly don't mind a call either.
10-09-2008, 09:23 AM
ilikeaces86

spew pre.
10-09-2008, 11:39 AM
IowaSkinsFan

Lol yeah forgot to comment I think it actually is a call pre but based on datamined 3bet% folding would seem more correct. Gith has always been pretty aggro versus me at least.
10-10-2008, 02:20 PM
Numbr2intheWorld

it was only like 200 mined hands fwiw
10-12-2008, 05:27 AM
Genitruc

this is too good for me
10-12-2008, 05:27 AM
Genitruc

random Q : are you raising a low flop with 2 spades?
10-12-2008, 01:29 PM
dsaxton

Re: I might be thinking too hard...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Massimo

I thought my problem here is that i'm rarely calling this flop with a strong hand against this sort of action, and that's what he probably assumes. I'm not gonna call a double barrel. So i thought my range was ridiculously exploitable and most players will take advantage.

I think this is an argument for not folding on the turn if he bets again and / or slow-playing strong hands on this flop, not an argument for folding the flop.

I think the main reason for folding the flop is just the fact that his range is super strong, like you mentioned.