QQ - Interesting Hand - Discuss

[allLiving]

No reads on anyone at the table.
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PokerStars Game #5340384938: Hold'em No Limit ($2/$4) - 2006/06/23 - 12:31:43 (ET)
Table 'Peacock' 6-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 1: lakes37 ($274.45 in chips)
Seat 2: check_kills ($807.65 in chips)
Seat 3: sscstmz ($385.65 in chips)
Seat 4: WSU Slacker ($395 in chips)
Seat 5: packers0641 ($382 in chips)
Seat 6: [595-ESCAPE] ($394 in chips)
lakes37: posts small blind $2
check_kills: posts big blind $4
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to [595-ESCAPE] [Qh Qc]
sscstmz: calls $4
WSU Slacker: folds
packers0641: raises $4 to $8
[595-ESCAPE]: raises $16 to $24
lakes37: folds
check_kills: calls $20
sscstmz: raises $16 to $40
packers0641: calls $32
[595-ESCAPE]: calls $16
check_kills: calls $16
*** FLOP *** [9s Qs Kh]
check_kills: checks
sscstmz: checks
packers0641: bets $84
[595-ESCAPE]: raises $270 to $354 and is all-in
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Discuss it all.

[dzeanah]

I think there's a good chance you're up against AA or KK preflop. The set is nice, but if another player has KK you're toast.

Without reads, it's hard to say. I probably would have folded with the action preflop if I had no reads...

[allLiving]

With $24 invested with 3-4 players calling, you fold another $12?

[chardrian]

{moved from Shorthanded Limit}

[dzeanah]

you're welcome to call me a nit. It's hard to play QQ as overcards on a low flop after that betting cycle, or with an A or K on the flop. Same with a set - you're good on a Q high flop, but my courage would waver if I also saw an A or K there.

My instinct with no reads is I'm up against a better hand. The flop tells me we both might have improved, and I might be about to lose a stack.

[allLiving]

You're very right that AA - KK is possible and I'm losing my stack here. But if the originally re-raiser had KK or AA, I personally think he'd be betting this flop hard because it is so draw heavy.

[dzeanah]

Not saying it's a bad play -- the argument I received in a post where I knew the villain had AA to my QQ preflop on an AQx flop was that a fold was incorrect because you can't have that accurate of a read on folks.

In this case though, I'm avoiding those tough post-flop decisions because I'm far from a postflop master. I'd fold QQ once I was convinced I was beat unless I had other information to bring into the decision.

[theDEEPdish]

hes getting the right odds to call the pre flop bet just to set hunt

[johnny_fish]

Strange play by the limpraiser. He probably realizes AA isn't good now, maybe you should've just called the flop bet. Although c/f this flop with AA/AK is too weak.. I guess you're pwned here

The flop bettor might be on 99/AK/KQ obviously.

[aislephive]

Standard. Raise more PF though, since it was a minraise. Folding to the minraise is awful, we have amazing implied odds. On this flop I'm going all the way with 100xbb stacks every time.

[gabe]

theres actually nothing interesting about this hand

[aislephive]

theres actually nothing interesting about this hand

Yeah, agreed. Ridiculously standard.

[allLiving]

theres actually nothing interesting about this hand

ty for the contributions.

[dzeanah]

So how'd it turn out?

[allLiving]

*** FLOP *** [9s Qs Kh]
check_kills: checks
sscstmz: checks
packers0641: bets $84
[595-ESCAPE]: raises $270 to $354 and is all-in
check_kills: folds
sscstmz: folds
packers0641: folds
[595-ESCAPE] collected $327 from pot
[595-ESCAPE]: doesn't show hand

[gabe]

theres actually nothing interesting about this hand

ty for the contributions.

i know i sounded like an ass, but what street is debatable?

[allLiving]

I thought it was interesting that he limp re-raised, then checked first to act.

[johnny_fish]

I guess he gave up on his AA.

[yorib]

Would there be any merit in calling the bet, hoping that one of the two people who checked, push? Getting more money in the pot? I can see AA/AK folding to a push (even 99), but no way they don't call that bet? A call, by you, in position, just signifies you may have something, but nothing that strong, or you could be on a draw and don't want to quit the hand yet.

Or is the board so scary that you never want to slow play this hand given the preflop action? There's $160 in the pot, so $80 is really just a c-bet/where am I type bet. The only cards you'd hate to see fall are A (and there might not even be any left in the deck). Everything else is fine (though a spade could be a scare card). Plus, if people are on low pp they might just hit their set and come along for the ride.