JJ late in the 11cube....

[Roco415]

280 left, 100 make money...do I ever not shove here? and why? i feel like any other raise is just as commiting and awkward...flatting is NEVER an option right?

PokerStars Game #46238243320: Tournament #318010874, $10+$1 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level X (300/600) - 2010/07/01 22:06:03 ET
Table '318010874 61' 9-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: helanosantos (30790 in chips)
Seat 2: Roco415 (11790 in chips)
Seat 3: cspurs1 (13082 in chips)
Seat 4: karen19 (13350 in chips)
Seat 5: PolyBaller22 (11894 in chips)
Seat 6: Akkilas_ (44369 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 7: BenRounded (6140 in chips)
Seat 8: Rambl (30812 in chips)
Seat 9: BrickedSlick (13880 in chips)
helanosantos: posts the ante 50
Roco415: posts the ante 50
cspurs1: posts the ante 50
karen19: posts the ante 50
PolyBaller22: posts the ante 50
Akkilas_: posts the ante 50
BenRounded: posts the ante 50
Rambl: posts the ante 50
BrickedSlick: posts the ante 50
karen19: posts small blind 300
PolyBaller22: posts big blind 600
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Roco415 [Jc Jd]
Akkilas_: folds
BenRounded: folds
Rambl: calls 600
BrickedSlick: raises 1200 to 1800
helanosantos: folds
Roco415: raises 9940 to 11740 and is all-in

[drmcboy]

..do I ever not shove here? and why?

he's running 2/1 over 500 hands?

reads help, vs a random shove is fine/standard. If you know he'll c bet a lot and or blinds are squeezer types flatting could be much better, why never an option?

[mcatdog]

What's so bad about flatting here? Most people have way too tight of ranges for raising over a limper, you're probably a very marginal favorite against his range. I mean in game I'd shove this 100% of the time but it's probably close in EV between shoving and flatting with both being miles ahead of folding.

[fjuanl]

The worse the limper the more you should be willing to see a flop with JJ, although ~57% of the time you'll be in a somewhat tough spot when overs hit. But with how weak the average villain is in the 10cubed, it shouldn't be too difficult with position.

Some other things to discuss:
- Worst pair that you flat here?
- Should we have much of a flat call range besides JJ-AA?

[Roco415]

is flatting an option with any hand here...maybe my thought process is rudimentary but with so much in the pot i just would rather use fold equity and take a shot at scooping the whole pot right there and not allow my self to make a mistake on the flop?

[TRimming1]

is flatting an option with any hand here...maybe my thought process is rudimentary but with so much in the pot i just would rather use fold equity and take a shot at scooping the whole pot right there and not allow my self to make a mistake on the flop?

I shove there myself. I think you played it correctly,as you were using fold equity as a tool to win.

[revolvingiris]

Some other things to discuss:
- Worst pair that you flat here?
- Should we have much of a flat call range besides JJ-AA?

A) Not really since we don't have odds to set mine and the lower the pair the more we hate flops.

B) I wouldn't think so in this dynamic but depending on villains tendency I might 4bet shove other pairs and AJ-AT.