58s multiway

[Nekrogovner]

well...i get the idea that hands like 58s are pretty shit to play in spots like this, and im going to be generally be pushing that play out of game. That said though, are there any good resources/articles for analytically deciding how we determine our preflop opening/calling ranges? I mean, Ive seen the whole 'generally, aj+, 88+ from utg, a bit more in mp, and a lot more in lp' idea, but my question is more what is the math behind designing these ranges on a hand by hand basis?

Hmmm, I actually find it hard to believe that you never read any resources on preflop play. Therefore I dare to deduce that you actually haven't read any books on poker at all. Because, virtually in every book (or articles for beginners), there is CHAPTER 1: Preflop play. And it usually has charts on opening and calling ranges, something that could be memorised to get you out of trouble while you develop your game.
Get a book.

[Zorkion]

Hmmm, I actually find it hard to believe that you never read any resources on preflop play. Therefore I dare to deduce that you actually haven't read any books on poker at all. Because, virtually in every book (or articles for beginners), there is CHAPTER 1: Preflop play. And it usually has charts on opening and calling ranges, something that could be memorised to get you out of trouble while you develop your game.
Get a book.

you sir, are a poo face.

i HAVE read books, and i HAVE read articles on preflop play. the thing is just that im not interested so much in memorizing some silly chart of what hands to play in different positions as much as i am interested in the reasoning that led to that conclusion. Thus, insofar as poker is a mathematical game, I am especially interested in the mathematically based foundations for these decisions


I HAVE MULTIPLE CENTIPEDES IN MY VAGINA


..er, books i mean. really. on my bookshelf.

[Nekrogovner]

you sir, are a poo face.

i HAVE read books, and i HAVE read articles on preflop play. the thing is just that im not interested so much in memorizing some silly chart of what hands to play in different positions as much as i am interested in the reasoning that led to that conclusion. Thus, insofar as poker is a mathematical game, I am especially interested in the mathematically based foundations for these decisions


I HAVE MULTIPLE CENTIPEDES IN MY VAGINA


..er, books i mean. really. on my bookshelf.

Poo face I may be, but still, silly charts are there for a reason, and that is, to make preflop decisions easy until you learn reasoning behind your actions.

Let me ask you a question.
Do you always call 58s vs an utg opener?
No? Why not? Is there a reasoning behind it or you simply have an inconsistent preflop strategy?
What is your VPIP? Do you know that VPIP of person who calls pre with 58s or better is around 55%? Is your VPIP that high?

[celtic123]

Let me ask you a question.
Do you always call 58s vs an utg opener?
No? Why not? Is there a reasoning behind it or you simply have an inconsistent preflop strategy?
What is your VPIP? Do you know that VPIP of person who calls pre with 58s or better is around 55%? Is your VPIP that high?

I like where this is going. And its all good.

[eugmac]

What is your VPIP? Do you know that VPIP of person who calls pre with 58s or better is around 55%? Is your VPIP that high?

Some very rough assumptions being made that the PokerStove slider % which includes 85s = hero's entire range. More likely that hero here gets excited with "implied odds" when he sees an UTG raiser (omg he has AA and will stack off every time I hit!) and a pretty suited hand, and had just had grossly overestimated the implied odds he actually has. Who of us here hasn't overestimated their implied odds at some point or another? Also situations like calling a BU steal in the BB with 55 and being surprised when you hardly ever win his stack when you hit a set.