Quote Originally Posted by MadMojoMonkey View Post
I don't agree with this. If you're gaining value post flop, and they're not folding PRE, then you should be raising PRE, to increase your post-flop value. If they're not folding, and you're IP, and outplaying them, charge them for it. Adjust your ranges, adjust your sizing, but don't tone down the aggression. Be patient for the right spots, and crush those spots.

I beat 5NL and 10NL on Bovada without ever limping except the occasional complete the SB when BB was not a raiser, and the odds were 9:1 with connector's... That's just printing money if you consider anything less than a straight as a 'trouble spot'. Sure, I c/f a ton in those cases, but when I flopped a straight, there's always someone who caught a big enough piece to allow me to c/r for a nice profit.


Seriously, you can almost mindlessly b/f those stakes and make an occasional Hero station when they're repping a very thin range. I did this for a while and took notes about my tough folds... Checked the HH's a day later and my accuracy rate was like 95%+. When I had to fold a big hand, it was almost always the right fold. My point is that they play so bad that those tough lay downs are basically easy lay downs, due to the raging imbalance in their raising range.
I agree that limping behind when you're guaranteed position is bad, and I don't do that on the button.

But otherwise, say you're in the CO and there's two limpers in front of you. You have some longshot starting hand (basically anything but an offsuit big/little). You can 1) fold pre and stay out of trouble which is reasonable.

2) You could limp behind knowing that it's highly likely that the button and blinds limp behind also, giving you great implied odds, where, if you do make a hand, you can beat them postflop by a) getting more value for your made hands and b) not paying off when you're beat, skills they're not as good at.

Or 3) you can raise the limpers preflop, with your K9 or 75s, and have everybody flat behind you. Now you're playing a big pot with a weak hand against players impervious to the one-street bluff. This isn't such a great spot because we will often miss and our advantage lies in playing our made hands better not bluffing.

I'm not so sure. The initiative is awesome at a site like Carbon with more 'regs' where far fewer hands get to showdown and most players do not want to continue with weak made hands oop.

I totally agree that we should always be raising the tpgk type starting hands like broadway from anywhere, and often 3betting them, because we're so far ahead of their range when we hit with good implied odds.

But with the weaker hands. Of the three choices, folding, raising, or seeing a flop cheap, you don't think seeing a flop cheap makes the most sense here?