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River flat missing value?

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  1. #1
    I don't understand the 3bet pre. This guy is a nit and his range already beats us, I don't get why we want to bloat a pot with AT against a nit.

    I'm gonna bet turn, probably b/f but a minraise might suck me in.

    River, I guess it's a raise. I don't expect he'll fold out any flushes, even 9x is going to struggle, so there's value for sure. I question if he jams with worse, I'd expect Kxhh to call a raise now, so I suspect a r/f line is best on river, but I lack this discpline and likely call off a jam pretty much all day long.
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
    ongies gonna ong
  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    I don't understand the 3bet pre. This guy is a nit and his range already beats us, I don't get why we want to bloat a pot with AT against a nit.
    The nit cold calls it, I 3bet someone else (can't remember his stats, but would have been folding a lot to 3bets)

    I'm gonna bet turn, probably b/f but a minraise might suck me in.
    I felt like his flop calling range had a lot of 9x and overpairs, and that if I bet I stand a pretty good chance of getting jammed on, so I checked it behind.

    River, I guess it's a raise. I don't expect he'll fold out any flushes, even 9x is going to struggle, so there's value for sure. I question if he jams with worse, I'd expect Kxhh to call a raise now, so I suspect a r/f line is best on river, but I lack this discpline and likely call off a jam pretty much all day long.
    Yeah, unless we're a lot deeper I don't think I can raise/fold. I either raise/call or just don't.

    I'm going to do the combos on this hand properly, everyone thinks I'm a massive nit flatting the river, but I just didn't see what he could call a raise with - maybe KhXh but that seemed like about it. Everyone else seems to think he won't fold a flush and might even feel commited with 9x or an overpair, I guess, although he's a nit, I wasn't putting enough weight on the fact that it's a 3bet pot.

    I'll go and do the combos now.
  3. #3
    OK, so these ranges I have specifically gone out of my way to try to make them such that they might contradict my idea that he can't call with worse.

    OK so preflop I'm giving him (to cold call a 3bet OOP):

    88-QQ, AQo+, KQo, A9s+, KJs+, QJs, T9s, JTs

    I'll say he might slowplay 99 just to allow some possibility of hands that do beat me getting there, and that he can flat with:

    88-QQ, KQhh, KJhh, QJhh, T9s, A9s

    Turn checks through, and he leads the river with:

    1 combo of 99 which beats me and:

    TT-QQ, KQhh, KJhh, QJhh, T9s, A9s

    All of which I beat.

    If I raise, I can get called by his flushes, maybe his A9 and occasionally maybe even QQ.

    But - I can't help but feel I've probably tried here specifically to contradict my own feeling that I couldn't raise and get called by worse. I think I have a fair bit to learn from this hand.

    I'd appreciate anyone elses range estimates for him.

    I don't want to spoiler what he showed up with yet, because I'm interested to know what ranges other people give him first - happy to spoiler it once anyone who's going to reply has done so though.

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