I work as an escort at an abortion clinic, ask questions or troll as you see fit.

[d0zer]

I've always been basically pro-choice, but since I've come to disagree with pro-choice people on almost every other issue (especially economic issues), I've felt the need to re-evaluate how I feel about abortion. I'm still pro-choice I think, but I think when you empathize with the women who get abortions, some curious thoughts emerge:

Someone (I think savy) referred to the women as being harassed in the "worst times of their lives." Why are these times so bad if there isn't a part of them that believes that they are murdering a child? I mean other than the physical discomfort of the procedure and the previous anxiety about being pregnant and all the future uncertain outcomes. To me, you either aren't killing a baby and its thus no big deal, or you are killing a baby and you're a fucking baby murderer. It's all from the perspective of the woman really, and if you believe you killed a baby but did it anyway, you're a piece of shit.

I also think the position of being pro-abortion "in events of rape or incest or mortal danger of the mother if the baby is carried to term" is some seriously weak sauce shit. Again because it is logically inconsistent. Either the fetus isn't a person and you should be able to toss 14 of them into a blender with some flax seeds and banana after your morning run, or it is a person and you'd be terrible to even consider that vivid mental image that you now can't un-know . Why does the event of the woman being raped by her father have any effect on this underlying reality?

For me, I think the issue of person-hood should be when a consciousness develops, not the number of chromosomes. We should develop some sort of litmus test for what constitutes a human consciousness, decide what the earliest point in utero that this emerges, abortion before that point should be unequivocally not murder, and abortion after that point should be unequivocally murder.

This post is full of false dichotomies. Unless you're comfortable making fetus smoothies you're a fucking piece of shit? Really? No shades of gray in the middle?

[Renton]

This post is full of false dichotomies. Unless you're comfortable making fetus smoothies you're a fucking piece of shit? Really? No shades of gray in the middle?

The shades of gray lie in the very normal reaction of feeling bad about destroying something with the potential to be a human being, and I don't think anything in my post ruled out this possibility. My problem is the logic behind what abortions people condemn and allow is inconsistent, often ridiculously so.

I think 75% or more of the pro-choice crowd would look down on a serial abortionist, some woman who gets like three per year and doesn't feel the slightest bit of remorse. To me I don't see a difference between that person and the woman who was impregnated by her father. I don't think this is a false dichotomy. Either its a life or it isn't. To me it isn't. I'm just saying pick a side and stop equivocating like a mofucker.

[d0zer]

The shades of gray lie in the very normal reaction of feeling bad about destroying something with the potential to be a human being

To me, you either aren't killing a baby and its thus no big deal, or you are killing a baby and you're a fucking baby murderer.

[Renton]

To me, you either aren't killing a baby and its thus no big deal, or you are killing a baby and you're a fucking baby murderer.

I guess I should clarify that I am referring to the act of killing a person in moral/legal terms. Of course its natural to feel bad about it, but I'm more interested in the reasons why you feel bad. I think that if you get an abortion and you think that abortion = killing a person, that makes you a willing perpetrator of murder from your own point of view. I think this is true even if you think there's a 1% chance you're killing a person. Sort of like how 1% of infinity is still infinity, the risk that you are killing a conscious sentient human being is unacceptable.

On the other hand, if your negative emotional response is a byproduct of female hormones that represent the core objective of a human being being to procreate and pass on genes, that is natural. I haven't been disputing that, I'm more disputing the illogical and inconsistent nuances the standard pro-life / pro-choice positions, such as "fine in cases of rape/incest etc" "fine as long as you don't do it too much," "fine as long as you were on birth control and it failed," etc.

[boost]

I guess I should clarify that I am referring to the act of killing a person in moral/legal terms. Of course its natural to feel bad about it, but I'm more interested in the reasons why you feel bad. I think that if you get an abortion and you think that abortion = killing a person, that makes you a willing perpetrator of murder from your own point of view. I think this is true even if you think there's a 1% chance you're killing a person. Sort of like how 1% of infinity is still infinity, the risk that you are killing a conscious sentient human being is unacceptable.

Why is the 1% infinity? I mean, yes, something is fucked up with a person who "fully" believes they are committing murder, and goes through with it anyways, but someone who is conflicted due to the current state of the issue is not the same as the former example. I mean, I'd venture to say that most women getting abortions are not any where near shallow philosophical depth we are right now. Some do, but calling those who don't, and therefore are conflicted, horrible people is.. I mean.. where are you even going with this?

How about this: If a woman is deciding whether to have an abortion or not, and some part of her believes it's murder because of her religious upbringing, but she also knows that due to her situation, herself and the child are highly likely to have an awful life. Herself and the father are hopeless drug addicts, both have long family histories of mental illness and hereditary physical ailments, they are homeless, etc. You're saying that categorically she is a bad person if she chooses to have the abortion?

On the other hand, if your negative emotional response is a byproduct of female hormones that represent the core objective of a human being being to procreate and pass on genes, that is natural. I haven't been disputing that, I'm more disputing the illogical and inconsistent nuances the standard pro-life / pro-choice positions, such as "fine in cases of rape/incest etc" "fine as long as you don't do it too much," "fine as long as you were on birth control and it failed," etc.

I agree that often there is an attempt to mask poor logic in nuance, but this is a complex issue and the attempt to hide poor logic in nuance doesn't negate the fact that there is nuance. Violence is more or less acceptable depending on the circumstances, why do you feel abortion is different?