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  1. #1
    The others are right, read the digest. I'll respond, though. Keep in mind that I'm an inexperienced player and am just getting my feet wet with cash games after playing a handful of SNGs. (I am a winning player over an insignificant number of hands.) Think about areas where you disagree with me (if any) and point them out. If you don't have any disagreements with me now, maybe you will after reading/rereading the beginner's digest.
    Quote Originally Posted by Razvan729 View Post
    is it wrong to call an all-in on a flop with flush and/or straight draws when your hand is top 2 pair at least? (EX. you have KsQd on the flop : KcQh4h)
    The straight and flush draws shouldn't be your concern when it comes to a decision to call. They do, however, give you a big incentive to put out a big bet to protect your hand to make certain you're giving draws the wrong odds to call.

    Download and install PokerStove. What would be the best draw your opponent could have? JhTh gives him a flush/open-ended straight draw. Even against that draw, you are a slight favorite and therefore should call every time if you put him on a draw (and note that sometimes, even when you aren't the favorite, you could have the right odds to call). If you hesitate because you've been sucked-out on in the past in these sorts of situations, you're being results-oriented, which is mindset that will dull your edge and widen your leaks.

    You may wish to note, that if he does have JhTh or something similar (like AhTh or AhJh), he's making a profitable play -- the fact that you're even asking this question means that some part of the time, a player like yourself holding a monster hand like top two will fold and he will win the pot outright. He'll also sweep a lot of pots against lesser holdings that would otherwise be coinflips (top pair and middle pair type hands). Meanwhile, at worst, he's something like a 32.9% underdog if he gets called. Even if he assumes his opponent has the strongest possible hand vs. his draw and will call his bet 100% of the time, depending on the pot size and effective stacks, it could still be a +EV move (though not necessarily the most profitable one).

    Anyway, back to your situation. You have to also consider the fact that your opponent could have a hand like KK, QQ or 44. These hands have your top two trounced. KK and QQ are unlikely because of the blockers (between your hole cards and the board, you can account for 2 of each of the 4 kings and queens ... so if there is only one combo of KK or QQ each that you opponent can have).

    This is where it pays to put your opponent on a range. How many hands has he been playing, what was the preflop betting like, and what betting action (if any) immediately preceded the all-in?

    Depending on the level you're playing at, many players will easily make this move with sets, any two pair, AA, top pair/good kicker type hands and solid draws. Let's say you can't exclude any of these hands from his range, and let's make this his entire range for now. Sometimes he might also make a move with lesser hands like TPWK, second pair, JJ, TT, gutshots or a stone bluff, but without more info we can't say he's doing that too often with much confidence. PokerStove the villain's range against your holdings and see what you get. Don't be afraid to do this during a game when a you're playing for deep stacks (you have a time bank; use it), and certainly do it after the hand has been played.
    how about A7 on a flop like A73? should i bet it hard, even go all in?
    This is an ideal value bet situation. If you can't see why, you'd be well-served to re-read whatever book you're playing by (or maybe toss it in the garbage and buy a different one). At microstakes you can bet it hard knowing that hands like TPTK or even weak aces will call you down or reraise. I wouldn't go all-in unless you're raised, otherwise you'll chase away too many middling hands; big hands will probably get it in either way, so don't rush it.

    is it ok to call any bet if the pot odds are good even if you lose?
    This question epitomizes results-oriented thinking. The whole point of considering pot odds (vs. your odds of making a draw) is that you're playing the percentages. You must accept the fact that you will lose some portion of the time (with some plays, you will lose most of the time) because the money you make when you hit will offset any losses you incur when you miss, over a sufficiently large sample of hands.

    This is one reason why responsible bankroll management is crucial. If your roll is too small you may bust out before you've seen enough hands to overcome the random element of the game.

    Ak on a flop like K 10 6... how shoul i play this hand?
    Bet strong and for value on every street. If you're playing a nitty/TAG type player, consider slowing down in response to extreme aggression, and/or if the board gets scary all the sudden (for example, if another T falls, or the turn/river come QJ, or there's a 4-flush).

    how should i play overpair on the flop? ex: QQ on a 793 flop? should i bet and if reraised fold?
    Consider the hands that could be raising you with, not just the hands that have you beat. AA, KK, sets, two pair he could be raising you with, sure. But players could also be doing this with hands like QQ, JJ, TT, A9, K9, AK, T8, 86, gutshots, and less often, weaker hands/complete air. What's your opponent's range? If he didn't 3bet, or closed the action preflop, you can probably safely take AA or KK out of his range unless you've seen him passively play such hands before. If the player is TAG or nitty and opened from early position, you can eliminate the two pair possibilities, K9, the OESDs, etc and so on. Put your opponent on a range than make your decision based on how you fare against that range.
    Last edited by Tukka; 11-17-2010 at 02:10 AM.
  2. #2
    Razvan729's Avatar
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    ty for the answers... i knew that you'll say to read, i did, seems stupid to ask these things since i read, here and aniwhere i could find.... asking these is not because i dont know or havent read , i did, i ask because i lose in 80% of those situations ,even if i am 70% favourite in all of them,and then i asked my self if theory is the same with practice, that is why i asked. i admit i do make mistakes, but i know when that happends and asume the losses. (sorry if my english is bad!)

    i am thinking that i am unlucky maybe and should stop playing.

    Yesterday i wrote down a few hands that put me in trouble and lost all. i just wanna know if is wrong play or badluck. if bad luck, happends to all or i am just not made for this game and should stop?

    All the next hands happend yesterday, during a 3 hour session and they are in the order that i played them.
    For all hands blinds are 0.02/0.05 $ on PokerStars 9 players.

    1. UTG, (new to the table so havent seen him play) raises 3BB, folded to me, i am first before CO, i reraise to 7BB with black KK, the BB call so doeas the UTG, everyone else folds.
    Flop Kh Qs 8s
    Checked to me, i bet the pot ( i have nuts ,the best chance a hand has to beat me is a flush, with 30% to the river, so i am 70% favourite), BB folds, UTG goes all in. I call. he wins with flush, his hand, 3s4s! did i play it wrong or think the flop wrong?

    2. i am CO QhQs, i raise 4bb , only SB calls ( he is loose, i seen him play a lot of raised pots with junk cards)
    Flop: Jh 2s 7d i bet the pot, he goes all in... i call... he has KK, i lose... wrong play?

    3. folded to 2nd Midlle position, he limps, i am Button with KK, i raise to 5 BB, folded to BB that calls, the limper reraises to 17 bb, i rereraise to 50bb, BB folds, limper goes all-in, i call. he makes set 10 ( he had 10 10 )i lose. wrong play?

    4. Early position makes 3bb raise, folded to, i am BB with Ah6h, i call.
    Flop: As 6d 5h he bets 1/2 the pot, i reraise 3 times his bet, he goes all in, i call... he has AK, river gives a K, i lose. wrong play?

    so is my play wrong with these hands or just unlucky?

    one more question... i ussualy go on a table with 50bb, if i double my self, should stand up and re enter another table so i can start over again with 50bb or should i keep the stack and try to improve it rather then lose it? should i risk a big stack that i won in 3 hours (10$) in a hand like AA, KK preflop all-in or on a flopped set? or maybe be more cautios and play safe with hard earned money?
    Last edited by Razvan729; 11-17-2010 at 08:19 AM.
  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Razvan729 View Post
    1. UTG, (new to the table so havent seen him play) raises 3BB, folded to me, i am first before CO, i reraise to 7BB with black KK, the BB call so doeas the UTG, everyone else folds.
    Flop Kh Qs 8s
    Checked to me, i bet the pot ( i have nuts ,the best chance a hand has to beat me is a flush, with 30% to the river, so i am 70% favourite), BB folds, UTG goes all in. I call. he wins with flush, his hand, 3s4s! did i play it wrong or think the flop wrong?
    reraise like a man not a fricking fish raise it to 11bb so that he is making a mistake calling. a small 3bet just gives him implied odds to call and hit his flush.

    2. i am CO QhQs, i raise 4bb , only SB calls ( he is loose, i seen him play a lot of raised pots with junk cards)
    Flop: Jh 2s 7d i bet the pot, he goes all in... i call... he has KK, i lose... wrong play?
    whats his stack size ?if he's shoving 10bb easy call , if you are both 300bb deep easy fold.you've seen him play raised pots with junk...whats he been shoving all in with?


    3. folded to 2nd Midlle position, he limps, i am Button with KK, i raise to 5 BB, folded to BB that calls, the limper reraises to 17 bb, i rereraise to 50bb, BB folds, limper goes all-in, i call. he makes set 10 ( he had 10 10 )i lose. wrong play?
    stack sizes and villains stats. is he tight or loose? assuming you are both 100bb deep your 4bet is too big . You can't put 50% of your stack in and fold.make it 30bb or shove rather than 50bb.

    4. Early position makes 3bb raise, folded to, i am BB with Ah6h, i call.
    Flop: As 6d 5h he bets 1/2 the pot, i reraise 3 times his bet, he goes all in, i call... he has AK, river gives a K, i lose. wrong play?
    fold pre. Fish call in the BB with Arag s .Villain is in early position i,e should be playing a strong range,against that range you aren't fareing well. You have two pair wow ....board pairs or higher cards ome and any bigger A automatically counterfeits you. play it in position not out of position.

    so is my play wrong with these hands or just unlucky?
    you played em all wrong, and your mistakes contrbuted to the amount you lost

    one more question... i ussualy go on a table with 50bb, if i double my self, should stand up and re enter another table so i can start over again with 50bb or should i keep the stack and try to improve it rather then lose it? should i risk a big stack that i won in 3 hours (10$) in a hand like AA, KK preflop all-in or on a flopped set? or maybe be more cautios and play safe with hard earned money?
    learn to play 100bb poker, 50bb is too easy to get all in with and you get pot committted too easily.The bigger the risk the stronger hand you want. read all the bankroll management stuff in the digest ....in fact all of the digest.
  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Tukka View Post
    The others are right, read the digest. I'll respond, though. *Keep in mind that I'm an inexperienced player and am just getting my feet wet with cash games after playing a **handful of SNGs. (***I am a winning player over an insignificant number of hands.) Think about areas where you disagree with me ****(if any) and point them out. If you don't have any disagreements with me now, maybe you will after reading/rereading the beginner's digest.............
    * I think you feet are soaked buddy!
    **How fucking big are your hands any how?
    ***What the hell do you consider insignificant?
    ****NOPE

    Great fucking post noobie...lmao

    I hope this means we have another contributor for sure?

    Thanks for the post
    "You start the game with a full pot o’ luck and an empty pot o’ experience...
    The object is to fill the pot of experience before you empty the pot of luck."

    Quote Originally Posted by XxStacksxX View Post
    Do you have testicles? If so, learn to bet like it
  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by HarleyGuy13 View Post
    Great fucking post noobie...lmao
    Thanks for the kind words and encouragement, and you're welcome.

    **How fucking big are your hands any how?
    ***What the hell do you consider insignificant?
    Well, I've played 2437 hands over 29 single table SNGs and 1076 hands in 6max ... so while I think I am playing winning poker (at these stakes), I can't say I have the stats to back that up.
    I hope this means we have another contributor for sure?

    Thanks for the post
    You're welcome.

    I hope to become a regular contributor, but I can be fickle in my interests and don't always follow things through. Of course, most of my interests don't have the potential to earn me much money.

    Right now I am loosely following Robb's 5k hand 10NL guide, but for 2NL because my bankroll is tiny. Most of the post-related homework assignments for the first 1k hands are overdue, so I'll dig through my HHs now to find something for you guys to pick apart (in their own threads, of course).

    I look forward to getting your feedback. Thanks again for the warm welcome.
  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Tukka View Post
    Thanks for the kind words and encouragement, and you're welcome.



    Well, I've played 2437 hands over 29 single table SNGs and 1076 hands in 6max ... so while I think I am playing winning poker (at these stakes), I can't say I have the stats to back that up.


    You're welcome.

    I hope to become a regular contributor, but I can be fickle in my interests and don't always follow things through. Of course, most of my interests don't have the potential to earn me much money.

    Right now I am loosely following Robb's 5k hand 10NL guide, but for 2NL because my bankroll is tiny. Most of the post-related homework assignments for the first 1k hands are overdue, so I'll dig through my HHs now to find something for you guys to pick apart (in their own threads, of course).

    I look forward to getting your feedback. Thanks again for the warm welcome.
    Tukka I must say I am very impressed as it is obvious you are grasping the concepts very well. I really thought you had much more experience based on your post.
    Robb's stuff is all very good as are many of the other contributors here at FTR. Looking forward to watching you progress. Hope you'll consider starting a blog.
    "You start the game with a full pot o’ luck and an empty pot o’ experience...
    The object is to fill the pot of experience before you empty the pot of luck."

    Quote Originally Posted by XxStacksxX View Post
    Do you have testicles? If so, learn to bet like it

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