Fitness Question

[Pascal]

Sup, seems to be some fitness gurus in here.

I used to do a lot of sports but got really unfit/unhealthy over last couple of years. Last week or two I've been getting back into jogging but the bottom of legs (I guess my calves) get really painful after 20-25 minutes.

I'm stretching before I run but are there any specific stretches I can do? I've done some searching but would prefer some other opinions, seem to be a few in here. Also, would it be help doing these stretches in sync breaks/a few times a day?

[kiwiMark]

try lathering your calves with coke zero and chewing sugar free gum during your runs

[spoonitnow]

Rubbing a little butter on it will help ease the pain. You can melt the butter in a small cup in the microwave if you'd like.

[BennyLaRue]

(I guess my calves)

I guessed my elbows hurt once. I was right.

[bigred]

This seems good. I typically don't stretch until 5-10 minutes into my run. You want to stretch warm muscles.

Best Calf Stretches Photo 2

[a500lbgorilla]

try lathering your calves with coke zero and chewing sugar free gum during your runs

This

Rubbing a little butter on it will help ease the pain. You can melt the butter in a small cup in the microwave if you'd like.

is

I guessed my elbows hurt once. I was right.

an

Active
forum.

[bigred]

Also, your running shoes play a big part in calf and foot pain. Running on trails versus concrete is also a major factor. Make sure you ice after if you're having soreness and stretch later that night and the next morning.

[a500lbgorilla]

Also, your running shoes play a big part in calf and foot pain. Running on trails versus concrete is also a major factor. Make sure you ice after if you're having soreness and stretch later that night and the next morning.

I use the elliptical. Low impact, high effort.

[bikes]

BROS. DO YOU EVEN LIFT?

[a500lbgorilla]

I do.

[wufwugy]

For pain while running: stretch, massage, and lose weight, all the while making sure to not continue running when pain hits. Getting into more details about what to target requires much more specific knowledge and examination of your specific problem, some of which I don't have the knowledge for. But most problems like this do come from over-exertion, lack of mobility, too much tension, and being overweight

I would honestly recommend not to do something like jogging. While it's good if you want to do it, it is one of the most unimaginative, unhealthy, and boring ways to exercise. If you have any extra time and money you can take up things like hiking and racquetball, which will pay substantially greater dividends physically, mentally, and even socially

[JKDS]

Nahhhhhh you're just out of shape. Not using your legs, then suddenly using them a ton is not something your body is used to.

If you're still getting pain after your 3rd or 4th week, then maybe somethings wrong. In that case your legs just arent strong enough for your body weight. Lift a little to build muscle, maybe some weight loss, and youll be able to do what you want in no time. Meanwhile, build flexibility a little bit and break more often then you'd like.

[BennyLaRue]

BROS. DO YOU EVEN LIFT?

You mean while jogging?

[BennyLaRue]

I noticed no one mentioned the very popular sports drink Diet Mountain Dew yet.

[a500lbgorilla]

I noticed

This

no one mentioned the

is a

very

very

popular sports drink Diet Mountain Dew yet.

Active forum.

[Eric]

I don't stretch before running but it's a lot warmer where I live.

[kiwiMark]

I also don't stretch before running any more, even if it's a bit cold, but I make sure that I walk for a little bit and transition it slowly up from there to the tempo I want to jog at, rather than my one dumbass flatmate who just used to full power it literally down the hallway and out the frontdoor (waking everyone up, cunt) at the beginning of his runs.

My method might be not recommendable.

[kiwiMark]

I noticed no one mentioned the very popular sports drink Diet Mountain Dew yet.

I decided to be more subtle in the interests of making the joke without inviting fourteen boring stories in here.

[jyms]

NEVER stretch cold muscles. Also as bigred said, shoes are huge important but many people think they need better shoes when in fact most shoes do too much. You need to learn as much as you can about shin splints and heel striking. You have to learn to run better and work on flexibility but stretch after you are warm.

Look up two things, Chi running or Barefoot running and learn as much as you can about posture, gait, heel strikes and why things like eversion, inversion and such that these shoe makers sell expensive shoes for are unnecessary.

[jyms]

For pain while running: stretch, massage, and lose weight, all the while making sure to not continue running when pain hits. Getting into more details about what to target requires much more specific knowledge and examination of your specific problem, some of which I don't have the knowledge for. But most problems like this do come from over-exertion, lack of mobility, too much tension, and being overweight

I would honestly recommend not to do something like jogging. While it's good if you want to do it, it is one of the most unimaginative, unhealthy, and boring ways to exercise. If you have any extra time and money you can take up things like hiking and racquetball, which will pay substantially greater dividends physically, mentally, and even socially

I would say Wuf is bang on with all of this but particularly the bolded part

[kiwiMark]

interested to hear more about the mental dividends part, unless it's just as subjective as the boring part

[Pascal]

NEVER stretch cold muscles. Also as bigred said, shoes are huge important but many people think they need better shoes when in fact most shoes do too much. You need to learn as much as you can about shin splints and heel striking. You have to learn to run better and work on flexibility but stretch after you are warm.

Look up two things, Chi running or Barefoot running and learn as much as you can about posture, gait, heel strikes and why things like eversion, inversion and such that these shoe makers sell expensive shoes for are unnecessary.

What do you mean, never stretch cold muscles? What should I be doing?

I've got a pair of running shoes from a good running shop, had them for a couple of years. I find them much more comfortable than my old shoes. My running style is far from perfect and I'll check out your links, thanks.

For pain while running: stretch, massage, and lose weight, all the while making sure to not continue running when pain hits. Getting into more details about what to target requires much more specific knowledge and examination of your specific problem, some of which I don't have the knowledge for. But most problems like this do come from over-exertion, lack of mobility, too much tension, and being overweight

I would honestly recommend not to do something like jogging. While it's good if you want to do it, it is one of the most unimaginative, unhealthy, and boring ways to exercise. If you have any extra time and money you can take up things like hiking and racquetball, which will pay substantially greater dividends physically, mentally, and even socially

Thanks for the advice. I'm slightly overweight (~210 pounds I guess, 6'2" or so). I like jogging, especially late at night when it's quiet. Not so much when it's cold though. The main reason I'm trying to get active again is I'm going to be playing football (soccer) after Christmas but I don't want to start playing again without at least becoming slightly active again before.

[Pascal]

Thanks bigred for the stretching links, I'm going to start doing them a few times a day.

[DoubleJ]

What do you mean, never stretch cold muscles? What should I be doing?

Warming up first, duder.

imagine yer muscles are a bit like blu-tak. if you warm it up first, it'll stretch 4ever. if you don't, as soon as you try to stress it, it snaps.

[Hawk]

Yep, just start with a good fast 5-10 minute walk (depending on how cold it is and how long it takes for your muscles to warm up) before you start running. If you really want to stretch before running, do it after the warmup, but it's not really necessary.

I would still definitely suggest that you stretch after your run to help with soreness.

[jyms]

ya pretty much what they said, Cold muscles don't stretch, you will strain ligaments and tendons and the connective tissues. Also stretches need to be long and slow not bouncy. If you want a small lesson on the golgi tendon I could write one but just know that you aren't fully stretching a muscle for at least 15-20 seconds until the golgi relaxes under constant and easy pressure.

Also you never mentioned your goals. Is it to run farther? or is this about fitness? If this is about fitness I could link you to about 100 articles on why intervals and sprints will do more for your fitness, VO2max and lean muscle retention than slow running, and it takes less time per session, is safer for your joints and back and will get you there in half the time or less.

[Pascal]

Main goal is to get thinner. Don't want to sign up to gym tho. Any tips?

[Hawk]

Running will help. A good diet will help more.

I have no idea how it's possibly this low, but you only burn about 100 calories per mile that you run.

[Pascal]

I have no idea how it's possibly this low, but you only burn about 100 calories per mile that you run.

asjidasjdisa

Working on diet, 3 regular meals a day, less fat etc more veg, not eating late at night.

[jyms]

80+ percent of fat loss is nutrition. You can do more in one week with food than you can do in a month of exercise. Your exercise choices will only determine how you will look after you have lost the weight.

There is also a huge difference in how you should eat depending on how much you need to lose, what your average day looks like and how close you are to eating a maintenance (healthy diet).

Example, 3500 calories is a lb or fat. jogging for an hour may burn anywhere between 450 to 700 Calories. So you have to run between 5-8 times for over an hour to burn 1lb if you eat exactly at maintenance. If you are eating 2K calories a day you can drop 500 calories a day and lose a lb a week without running, getting sore or risking long term injury, I personally don't recommend either one.

Long story short. No starch or fruit at any time except post workout. Eat nothing but protein and veggies (salads). IF you want to include starch or fruit do it immediately post workout. Sprint then walk. 30 secones all out sprinting, walk for 1 minute. do 8 sprints. That also includes a 4-5 min warmup, and a 2-3 minute cool down of walking briskly.

Why is a gym not an option?

[jyms]

Running will help. A good diet will help more.

I have no idea how it's possibly this low, but you only burn about 100 calories per mile that you run.

Because the muscles are not the biggest calorie burners and have less to do with metabolism and fat burning than you think, particularly when used in an aerobic zone where you are running on predominantly oxygen.

asjidasjdisa

Working on diet, 3 regular meals a day, less fat etc more veg, not eating late at night.

This is wrong on so many levels and why so many people are fat now following guidelines that have been wrong for decades. Fat is not the enemy, starches are. More protein, eat when hungry, timing and amount of meals means nothing

[Pascal]

Awesome post, thanks so much.

I was thinking to avoid gym for another month because I'm going away for like a week and a half over Christmas but tbh I might as well just sign up now for 6 months (min contract) otherwise I'm going to lose the time at the end of term anyway over exams.

What would you recommend doing in the gym?

I also really, really need to quit smoking. I'm putting on weight around my stomach and I know smoking causes it. So writing this here - quitting today.

[jyms]

tell the gym you are going away and you want the extension, if they won't give it to you then you leave and sign up when you get back. They won't let you leave in case you go somewhere else. OR tell them your a member somewhere else until January and are just shopping, they will cover you to get your name on the contract.

[surviva316]

I used to do a lot of sports but got really unfit/unhealthy over last couple of years. Last week or two I've been getting back into jogging but the bottom of legs (I guess my calves) get really painful after 20-25 minutes.

I've had problems with tightness in my calves and achilles tendon over the last 6 months, and my girlfriend (a physical therapist) has given me some stretches to add to my repertoire. The main one is to press your hands against a wall with one leg behind the other and bend your front leg (keeping your back leg straight) until you feel a stretch in your calf. Then, to stretch your achilles, bend your back leg until you feel a stretch in your heel area. The stretch is even more effective if you can do it on a staircase with your back foot one stair down.

There were also a couple of times that my feet (especially my arches) were bothering me, but she ran some tests and said that my plantar is fine, and it's really my achilles that's the problem, and I have shitty shoes so these are combining to make me adjust my gait which is putting undue pressure on my arches.

Anyway, unless these just happen to be your exact problems, this might not help as much--you'd have to actually have someone look at you to get a good set of stretches and specific diagnoses and such--but I thought something in there might help (especially the stretches).

[Pascal]

tell the gym you are going away and you want the extension, if they won't give it to you then you leave and sign up when you get back. They won't let you leave in case you go somewhere else. OR tell them your a member somewhere else until January and are just shopping, they will cover you to get your name on the contract.

Sweet, good plan. My normal routine in the gym is just rowing then the using random resistance machines. Sometimes treadmill too. Is this OK?

I've had problems with tightness in my calves and achilles tendon over the last 6 months, and my girlfriend (a physical therapist) has given me some stretches to add to my repertoire. The main one is to press your hands against a wall with one leg behind the other and bend your front leg (keeping your back leg straight) until you feel a stretch in your calf. Then, to stretch your achilles, bend your back leg until you feel a stretch in your heel area. The stretch is even more effective if you can do it on a staircase with your back foot one stair down.

There were also a couple of times that my feet (especially my arches) were bothering me, but she ran some tests and said that my plantar is fine, and it's really my achilles that's the problem, and I have shitty shoes so these are combining to make me adjust my gait which is putting undue pressure on my arches.

Anyway, unless these just happen to be your exact problems, this might not help as much--you'd have to actually have someone look at you to get a good set of stretches and specific diagnoses and such--but I thought something in there might help (especially the stretches).

Great info, thanks for the post. Will try out those stretches

[surviva316]

I see that bigred already demonstrated my calf stretch in picture form, though again, it's supposedly much preferable to do it on the stairs.

jyms also makes a good point about shin splints if you're having unspecified pain somewhere in the lower half of your leg after running for a while. It's very common, but it is technically a stress fracture so it should be treated intelligently if you don't want it to be a bother for a long time.

[wufwugy]

interested to hear more about the mental dividends part, unless it's just as subjective as the boring part

If you jog you get the physiological benefit, but you tend to do as little as you can because it's so uninteresting. If you do something like hiking, you generally end up doing a lot more than you thought because it's fun and dynamic as well as it stimulates your brain in a myriad of non-exercise ways

If you burn a thousand calories playing water sports like surfing or wakeboarding, you're going to feel soooooooo much better about life than if you do the same by jogging

[BennyLaRue]

Long story short. No starch or fruit at any time except post workout. Eat nothing but protein and veggies (salads).

Thanks, jyms. Good post, but any particular reason you have salads highlighted here?

[wufwugy]

because people think french fries are vegetables

[JKDS]

Fuck salad. THERE, I SAID IT

[jyms]

yes Wuf is right, potatoes aren't veggies, not even sweet potatoes. Only eat veggies you can eat cold. Yes you can cook things like cabbage, spinach, broccoli and Cauliflower but they are able to be eaten raw. Nobody eats raw sweet potato, idaho potatoes, beets, turnip, squash. Things like mushrooms, tomato, onion anything that can go in a salad can be eaten almost as much as you want.

[BennyLaRue]

because people think french fries are vegetables

Nobody that deserves to not be fat.

[BennyLaRue]

yes Wuf is right, potatoes aren't veggies, not even sweet potatoes. Only eat veggies you can eat cold. Yes you can cook things like cabbage, spinach, broccoli and Cauliflower but they are able to be eaten raw. Nobody eats raw sweet potato, idaho potatoes, beets, turnip, squash. Things like mushrooms, tomato, onion anything that can go in a salad can be eaten almost as much as you want.

Good clarification, because we don't need people eating caesar salad every day and going, WTF JYMS, MY HUGE ASS?!?!

[wufwugy]

Good clarification, because we don't need people eating caesar salad every day and going, WTF JYMS, MY HUGE ASS?!?!

Truth be told, if the only thing you eat is meat and vegetables you cook yourself with whatever seasoning you like and a moderate amount of sauce, you'll be lean as fuck. Also the tastiest foods in the world include stir-fry and salads. It's really just when you start including the condensed grains that you start getting fat. Noodles and bread with get you every time, but you can eat a bunch of meat and veggies and look and feel great. Even fat heavy stuff like cheese works because it provides a lot of taste for a small amount

[BennyLaRue]

Truth be told, if the only thing you eat is meat and vegetables you cook yourself with whatever seasoning you like and a moderate amount of sauce, you'll be lean as fuck.

Sure but there is what you and jyms mean by these general statements about protein and vegetables and what people who don't know any better read into those comments, ie. I can eat all the bacon, cheese and red meat I want, usually at the same time and salad consists of iceberg lettuce and ranch dressing. Sodium? Bring it. Trans-fats? Bring-it. Cheat days? I only had one or two so I'm awesome. Who needs a fully functioning liver and kidneys anyway?

It's good advice, just not going as far as it could if we're talking about general health. My point is, vegetables are great and important. People will find them more interesting and be more apt to eat them if they have a variety and a variety of different ways to prepare them.

As JKDS eloquently pointed out, some people (not me, but some like him) only like to fuck salad.

[NightGizmo]

Nobody eats raw sweet potato, idaho potatoes, beets, turnip, squash.

I knew a guy in high school that ate a whole raw potato every day in math class (skin and all). But he was trying to gain weight for wrestling -- I wouldn't recommend it for weight loss!

I've always heard (correct me if this is wrong) that resistance/weight training will elevate your metabolism for a few days after you work out, and your muscles will keep burning calories while they recover (my appetite is significantly higher when I'm sticking to a workout routine). But running will only burn calories during the run itself. So weight training is actually a better way of trimming fat from your body.

Just keep in mind -- if you're training with weights, you will gain muscle mass as you lose fat, so you won't see your weight on a scale drop super-fast. But your body will get into much better shape.

[OngBonga]

Instead of pre-run stretches, try drinking a cup of tea while smoking a spliff. It's what I do, and I'm yet to go for a run, let alone hurt my calves.

[surviva316]

Instead of pre-run stretches, try drinking a cup of tea while smoking a spliff. It's what I do, and I'm yet to go for a run, let alone hurt my calves.

ONG HOW'D YOU GET TO BE SO COOL AND EDGY!

[swiggidy]

Can we clarify running/jogging/walking? I feel like very few people are actually running. I will give you it is inefficient, not for everyone, and possibly dangerous for a n00b (but so is trying to max a bench press, blah blah meow chow).

If you're doing 3 miles at 10 minute pace you're basically walking and it isn't going to do shit for weight loss. Last year I was running 6 miles at 8 minute pace and it felt pretty awesome.

[JKDS]

Further, is jogging/running unhealthy only when done excessively?

[Jack Sawyer]

Sprints, yo. In sets, 100 - 150 meters max per set. Rest plenty in between, after 4 call it a day.

[wufwugy]

Further, is jogging/running unhealthy only when done excessively?

It's one of the worst "common" exercises that can be done on the body for reasons like rough on joints and poor alignment

[wufwugy]

The thing about exercise for weight loss is that it is not the means to the end. Its purpose in life is to engage in activities that make life better (like hiking and snowboarding and flag football). Losing weight is pretty much just all about the diet

I know it's tough to get exercise the right way, by engaging in activities that are fun and social, but that's the truth. It's only tough because humans are naturally self-conscious, but if you get past that you're golden

[wufwugy]

The main benefit of exercise is not body composition changes but physiological changes that simply make you feel better as you go about your day

[OngBonga]

ONG HOW'D YOU GET TO BE SO COOL AND EDGY!

Hanging around in poker forums. It's all thanks to you guys.

[kiwiMark]

If you jog you get the physiological benefit, but you tend to do as little as you can because it's so uninteresting. If you do something like hiking, you generally end up doing a lot more than you thought because it's fun and dynamic as well as it stimulates your brain in a myriad of non-exercise ways

If you burn a thousand calories playing water sports like surfing or wakeboarding, you're going to feel soooooooo much better about life than if you do the same by jogging

aight fair enough, so I can chalk it up to "doesn't super apply to me because I lurve running". I'd also say I enjoy jogging (or swigalking [I do a bit more than 3 miles at 8 minute pace, where does that put me?!]) for many although not all of the same reasons I enjoy hiking, but I can see that being totally different if you're just thinking "this is shit, this is shit, how long've I been going for already damnit that's not very long this is shit" the whole time.

I can definitely support a "find some exercise you actually enjoy or it's never really gonna work out well for you" call.

[Renton]

Can't really add much to what's already been said. If you live in a drug-lax country, find some thyroid hormone (T3) and take 50mcg a day.

[surviva316]

Hanging around in poker forums. It's all thanks to you guys.

You know, if you were even remotely deserving of such awesomeness, I would totally call you annyonga. But as such, leaving an opportunity at one of the greatest nicknames of all time is just another contributor to the negativity that is wrought by your existence.

[sam1FTR]

Another thing I would suggest is potassium. Eat a lot of bananas. It keeps your body feeling healthy, especially after running

[OngBonga]

You know, if you were even remotely deserving of such awesomeness, I would totally call you annyonga. But as such, leaving an opportunity at one of the greatest nicknames of all time is just another contributor to the negativity that is wrought by your existence.

My existence brings joy to some. You don't know me, you just judge me. I am awesome. Ask the family dog. Ask my nephew. And my niece. Yay it's Uncle Matt! That's what they say when they see me. And the dog goes ballistic. My existence is far from negative. I think you need happy pills. Talk to someone you're close to. Tell them that there's this guy on the internet who makes you feel negative. Listen to them when they say how ridiculous that is. Have a smoke, or a pint. Listen to some music that you love. Think happy things. It's all in your head, you have the power to change the way you feel about things. Good luck.

[Pascal]

Think today went well. Signed up to the gym on a 6 month membership which expires just about when I finish my degree anyway. Had a bagel for breakfast, Mexican bean soup for lunch and then a vegetable stirfry with only a tiny bit of oil and lots of beansprouts for dinner. Went to the gym, ran and rowed, was just going to come back but met some friends who were doing weights and they showed me around a bit, never done weights before so was interesting. Arms kill now.

Planning on taking tomorrow off and back to gym on Thursday/Friday. Also, haven't smoked in 2 days, vamoooo

[Pascal]

Also def not planning on doing weights very often. Would rather lose weight than think about building muscle. It was fun though!

[kiwiMark]

jyms and the others who are more informed are gonna no doubt pounce all over your last reply so I'll keep it short: do weights thumbsup

[Pascal]

If doing weights means losing weight I'm in

[kiwiMark]

like a bajillion times moreso than doing cardio does afaik, but again I'm the furtherest thing from an expert so I'll stop talking and leave you hanging till someone with knowledge comes along

[NightGizmo]

If doing weights means losing weight I'm in

Doing weights = losing fat. You'll gain muscle, so your weight won't drop as much as if you just lost weight using diet/cardio, but you'll be healthier.

[Pascal]

I'm cool with that. I'll need to have a specific diet with protein etc to aid muscle building though right? Any help welcome (pls jyms)

[ttwarrior1]

absolutely nothing healthy about jogging or running in marathons

[ttwarrior1]

google hit training, its the best way to build muscle. You need carbs to build muscle, not protein. Of course you need some protein but a protein shake of 50 grams of protein is only 200 calories and won't do jack crap.

I bet you never heard this before or the supposed online experts. To build muscle, you have to stimulate growth and once its stimulated anymore than that is overtraining.

[surviva316]

My existence brings joy to some. You don't know me, you just judge me. I am awesome. Ask the family dog. Ask my nephew. And my niece. Yay it's Uncle Matt! That's what they say when they see me. And the dog goes ballistic. My existence is far from negative. I think you need happy pills. Talk to someone you're close to. Tell them that there's this guy on the internet who makes you feel negative. Listen to them when they say how ridiculous that is. Have a smoke, or a pint. Listen to some music that you love. Think happy things. It's all in your head, you have the power to change the way you feel about things. Good luck.

Either I got myself into a leveling war that I'm doomed to lose or you actually think that I despise you, and either way now is a good time to point out that I love you.

[jyms]

Yes god damn it do weights. Your not going to build 20 lbs of muscle without some serious time and effort (years) but when you work out with weights you will get stronger, burn tons more calories and actually look better when you have lost considerable weight because the weight loss will be predominantly fat and not muscle because of the muscle sparring effects.

Think today went well. Signed up to the gym on a 6 month membership which expires just about when I finish my degree anyway. Had a bagel for breakfast, Mexican bean soup for lunch and then a vegetable stirfry with only a tiny bit of oil and lots of beansprouts for dinner. Went to the gym, ran and rowed, was just going to come back but met some friends who were doing weights and they showed me around a bit, never done weights before so was interesting. Arms kill now.

Planning on taking tomorrow off and back to gym on Thursday/Friday. Also, haven't smoked in 2 days, vamoooo

Contraty to popular belief I won't jump on the other post but I will on this one. THIS IS WHY YOU AND EVERYONE ELSE IS FAT. This is the most horrible way to eat to lose weight, I will say it again, fat is no tthe enemy, starches are. Where the fuck is the protien in this day? You need to be eating at least 1 gm of protein per lb of body weight, and I would probably push that to 2 gms per pound until you learned to eat meat at every meal. On a fat loss, healthy meal scale this was 3/10!!


Great job on the smoking. Want a suggestion, I want you to eat 3 whole eggs, one steak the size of your hand and two chicken breasts every day along with two giant salads with some kind of dressing you make yourself with Greek yogurt, cottage cheese or olive oil and vinegar. Next we will talk about supplementation.

[wufwugy]

IIRC if you keep carbs low enough (usually somewhere below 100g), you end up burning up to 25% more of what you eat due to having to use protein for fuel. I guess that's why a tiger can eat a shitload and still be sick lean; dat thermogenic effect.

[OngBonga]

Either I got myself into a leveling war that I'm doomed to lose or you actually think that I despise you, and either way now is a good time to point out that I love you.

Gay.

I couldn't tell if you were serious or not, so I figured I'd just troll you with nonsense, if only to amuse myself. I was lying anyway, only my Nephew goes "Yay it's Uncle Matt!", my Niece just looks at me as if I'm some weird random stranger until she remembers who I am. Bless her.

[jyms]

IIRC if you keep carbs low enough (usually somewhere below 100g), you end up burning up to 25% more of what you eat due to having to use protein for fuel. I guess that's why a tiger can eat a shitload and still be sick lean; dat thermogenic effect.

It's called the thermic effect of food. It's why the Calorie is a calorie thing is a problem for me. 4 calories per gram of protein and carbs. it takes almost half the calories to digest and use protein and about a quarter of the calories for carbs. Excess protein is very hard to convert to fat because the body needs to turn it into glucose first (glucenogenisis) and then convert the sugar to fat. By the time the body does all that it's basically burned it all through processing. Starch is turned to glucose easily and excess glucose is turned to fat rather easily in comparison.

Both the spelling and the theory here is very vague and not to be taken word for word. It's been dumbed down to make it easy to understand. I can link the articles if you want to read hundreds of pages on this stuff.

[JL]

Contraty to popular belief I won't jump on the other post but I will on this one. THIS IS WHY YOU AND EVERYONE ELSE IS FAT. This is the most horrible way to eat to lose weight, I will say it again, fat is no tthe enemy, starches are. Where the fuck is the protien in this day? You need to be eating at least 1 gm of protein per lb of body weight, and I would probably push that to 2 gms per pound until you learned to eat meat at every meal. On a fat loss, healthy meal scale this was 3/10!!

Maybe everyone is fat because you are saying unreasonable things like this. Two grams of protein per pound of body weight. Are you serious?

I weigh 200lbs, so I would need to eat 400g of protein per day. So after my steak (50g), 2 chicken breasts (60g), and 3 eggs (18g), I would still need to consume 272 grams of protein...