Ultimate Werewolf

[Luco]

I'm gonna go on record and say I think mojo is a villager. However I really think his comments are going to cause problems for us in later game if we let him off the hook. And besides, just because I'm having doubts, doesn't means he actually is a villager.

But if mojo is a villager, well there was such momentum against him that there would be no reason for the wolves to get involved, they could just sit back and let it happen, knowing they avoid scrutiny for the way the wagon built. That's what I'd do, and it's what I'd be suggesting the other wolves do. An all villager mislynch on d1 is the perfect start for the wolves, especially if it's a majority lynch.

I think we would be more likely to see a spread of wolves, it's unlikely his wagon is all villager imo

[baudib]

So let me be clear on this.

Baudib thinks mmm is likely villager and Daven is likely wolf.

However if he is very much open to a mmm lynch.

He also says he knows mmm will get lynched later so he doesn't need to be lynched now.

That means he'd rather lynch a very strong player now in the knowledge that he has an easy lynch later, as opposed to waiting to see how his day 1 read evolves on a strong player and removing an easy lynch now.

Wolves love late game easy lynches.

Wolves love removing strong players.

Your behavior is that of a wolf!

Dan, you weren't in the last game so perhaps you don't understand the resentment about MMM. Absolutely no one will or shouldtrust MMM in a crucial spot. If he's a wolf I'm pretty damn sure he will out himself.

The fact that you had Daven as a good lynch and MMM as a likely villager and yet agreed with Daven's point on MMM and want to lynch him instead is ridiculously sketchy. Are you projecting?

Pushing someone else back to the lynch pile but being willing to snap-lynch them later is pretty standard. For instance, if you have someone who is theoretically seer-hunt cleared yet is still alive in 2 days, you probably need to turbo lynch him. If someone who regularly gets nommed N1 is alive on D5, he probably needs to die. Acting like you don't understand this concept is mind-blowing.

And if you think I'm a wolf you frankly haven't read a damn thing I've posted so far.

[Luco]

In response to key's 'this is not vanilla daven' post:

lol really? re the claim that this is not a vanilla daven - go read some daven=vanilla games and then take that comment back.

I asked this in my big post so it may have been missed, but again - keybored how much experience of vanilla daven do you have?

[baudib]

Luco, I think it's just a style thing. Actually it seems his style is more "Tbh" but also a lot of "honestly." and a lot of "literally"s in this V game.

Yeah I'll be honest part of the reason I said one wolf was bussing was because I always heavily doubt wolves go all in on ~anything

TBH every one of these night games when I'm a wolf I never post at night

I had a fundraiser and couldn't touch my phone at all literally line out the door from 11 till just now and I don't even have the energy to walk

it's about time I get mislynched, tbh.

and I literally came in and posted, arrived in my house and fell asleep for six hours

I wouldn't blame you for lynching me for missing so much, tbh

[dhubermex]

It's coming up on my 5:00-6:00am bedtime here and I'm not really awake enough to post anything meaningful except I was trying to come up with a good reason why Keybored would (again) try to prod so hard and become Thread Captain if he's a Villager this time around. The reasoning I've come up with is that I believe he was attempting to apply pressure on daven and gain more information, which he has accomplished.

To baudib: re: Post #506 Part 1.... I'm sure this is good advice regardless of alignment. The fact is that I'm a bit results-oriented given my reads in previous matches, although I'll be the first to admit that there was also some run-good involved. Those reads were mostly made on single posts or very specific tells that I thought I had picked up on. I certainly don't "know" that MMM is a Wolf though... I simply believe there is a higher chance than random that he's aligned with the bad guys and have already stated why I want him out regardless of alignment. This stance is backed up by several players in the thread, and they can't all be Wolves.

To MMM: haha I think you're right that this daven wagon may make me cry at some point. Personally I don't understand why the wagon isn't 15. The way I see it, Villagers should be steaming for an MMM lynch, Wolves should be, rilla (who isn't even playing) should be, etc.

To all: [Sorry for the poker story]For some reason I'm thinking the MMM wagon should be similar to a situation I witnessed when I played my first hand of live cash game poker at the Gold Coast in Vegas years back... I opened 3x from early position with AQ in a $2/$5 cash game, and got like 7 calls behind. By the time I got through telling the story to my friends, I was telling them that I could have sworn that one of the players at the table called a buddy of his who was way out at the Sahara just so he could haul-ass over there and dump his $15 in the pot. [/Sorry for the poker story]

So... completely irrelevant but I want to know...

Ong, Post #33... did that thought come to mind about 5 seconds after inhaling?

Posts #35 & #52... did those thoughts come to mind about 1 minute after inhaling?

No judgement obviously. I'm just curious as a former smoker myself as I had times when I would say something immediately after an inhale then wonder shortly thereafter how it actually came off to someone whose mind was not altered. Post #33 especially is a frame of mind that I expressed more than once and then would begin to think that it may have come off differently than whatever it was I had intended. FWIW I don't think it's alignment-indicative.

[baudib]

more

I am literally amazed

Literally flabbergasted that I go afk for an hour and everyone jumps on me

honestly I didn't even realize jay left a peek at all

these are all within like ~ 75 posts.

[Luco]

Luco, I think it's just a style thing. Actually it seems his style is more "Tbh" but also a lot of "honestly." and a lot of "literally"s in this V game.

Thanks for the spade work baud, to be honest I was leaning that way anyway

[baudib]

Thanks for the spade work baud, to be honest I was leaning that way anyway

wolfy.

[Luco]

wolfy.

It's genuinely legit

[dhubermex]

TBH, I'd like to thank baudib for the data-grab.

[baudib]

Dhuber: I get 7 callers per hand when I raise all the time.

And I get where you are coming from re: MMM and I think your intentions are pure. But it seems like you're overreacting a bit and accepting too high an amount of villager equity. Lynching someone regardless of alignment is never going to be optimal.

Let me tell you about a game I had earlier this month. I was a villager, the seer peeked a wolf n0, left his peek in an ambiguous fashion and the wolf got lynched in a tight vote. I vigged a wolf that night (I wish we had a vig in this game, would solve all of this), so there was only 1 wolf vs. 9 villagers.

Before the 2 wolves died, Player A "accidentally" posted fake "wolfchat" in the game thread and said, "ooops, disregard that." He was a villager.

I told another player that I was going to night kill him. Player A saw what I did, gave me a thumbs-up for it and no one else mentioned it.

Player C "conceded" as the last wolf, and when no one believed him, he repeatedly claimed wolf after each mislynch. He was a villager, too.

People do wacky shit in this game to judge reactions.

Like I said, average in the new information with the old, don't focus on one thing. Things can change quickly in this game.

[Luco]

Did I? Feel like I'm hinting at something else as in putting in a lot of effort for appearance that doesn't translate to particular value add for the village...awfully wolfy imo

My bad, I misread that then. Carry on and do yer thang.

I read it the same way as baud

[Luco]

Still think Aubrey is most likely wolf candidate and it's telling that she's not getting steam.

I'd prefer Daven over MMM based on this page's arguments and my short memory/attention span.

What's the vote count and time remaining? It's blastoff time!

Aubrey - it's not telling imo. The main wagons are too strong.

Still feeling good about bigred

[Keith]

First wolf to cry out, folks.

Keith, I'm not campaigning for an "alternate" to MoMo. I'm saying MoMo's not a wolf and my vote is better off sitting on someone who IS wolfy. I'm NOT voting for someone who is "likely" to be a distraction later. Your "if" he get's lynched and "then" comes back to (potentially) flip "cursed" statement is super weak and not to your usual standard. You speak very seldom and very little, so every word has to be "examined" closely. Therefore, here's my read: Wolf Keith started the MoMo lynch D1 thinking it's a free wolf kill with absolutely no backlash. If I was a wolf, it woulda been my first vote, no question. Keith, I'm not stalling. I'm saying you motivated the wolves to pounce on the weakest known player and you made the first vote along that line.

this is one hell of a logic fail. Since when is it +ev for the wolves to get rid of a guy who cracks under pressure. Wolves try to take out the specials and/or strong players first not the weak players . DId you read the "discussion" that MMM and I had post game last game. It was fricking obvious to everyone who played last game that MMM would be my first day one lynch vote this game. MMM acknowledges that in his early posts. SInce you want to examine my every word , explain to me how MMM posted his first post the same minute that Hoopy posted the thread. That implies he was sat there refreshing the forum to see the thread and he certainly didn't have time to read the post to find out what roles were playing. Villagers aren't sat there refreshing the thread and insta posting, they read the intro , the rules and what roles the village has.

BID, you're 60 posts behind? Yet you come out above and town on Ong/Luco/Dhuber?? Not cool.

What's this business about MMM being a distraction later? Are we talking about his surrender last game? Cuz that's bullshit. The dude's a scientist ffs. His whole life is about experimentation and learning from trial/error. If anything, he's the absolute last person who'll quit or waffle late game after that life lesson. And keep in mind, he fought tooth/nail the entire way last game after all the "superpowers" were waylaid along the trail. Are we worried about his early feint this game? Why? First, he didn't run away from defeat/shame last game. Second, he obv worked in the off season to sharpen his game. Third, he came here with a new approach (as others here have espoused also). And finally, he tried a bold new move. Now, I completely agree, his entire first page is awful, but I'm looking at the whole person.

Folks, the MMM wagon is built on a false foundation created by wolves who obv made the conscious plan to pounce on the weakest player. DO NOT BE FOOLED.

Are you being deliberately dense? He's a distraction BECAUSE he tried to pull a move. How do you know for sure that he is a villager like you are claiming. Only the wolves can know that .He is a distraction because the rest of the village cannot be sure whether he was pulling that move to signal to the wolves that he is cursed or doing it as a trap like he claims and the scenario i posted showed why leaving him alive into the endgame could be disastrous for the village. Check the timing of his solo wolf post, it was after my original bold of him. Claiming solo wolf in a game where there is a cursed villager and he has already been called out on his insta post at the start of the game shows a lack of judgement , just as his quitting last game also showed a lack of judgement.That is why he should go now before his bad decision making hurts the village again like it did last game. Its already doing it this game with the discussion abiut his motives for his post.

So what yer saying Aubrey, is...
...after I outed 2-3 wolves sitting on the easy MMM wagon...
...where I asked Dhuber and BID to jump ship to the Daven wagon to expose them baddies...
...after I outed Keith for starting the weak wolf MMM wagon...
...and then Daven flailed about like a landed fish...
...which left which wolves exposed on the MMM wagon??
Oh yah...Wuf & Rong & Aubrey & Ong, sitting in a tree: K-I-S-S-I-N-G.

SOULREAD: The 4 Wolves are locked in here: Keith/Daven/Wuf/Aubrey/Rong.

Col Mustard/In the Library/with the Lead Pipe
Envelope please.

You have 4 wolves locked in . Theres only 3 wolves and a cursed villager and the cursed villager (if not MMM) certainly has no clue whether MMM is an outed wolf or a villager. SO why exactly did you say 4 wolves?Is this a POV slip?

[Hoopy]

Vote Count 1.4

MMM - 8 (keith, wuf, rong, dhuber, aubrey, BID, Ong, daven)
daven - 6 (baudib, keybored, Luco, MMM, bigred, monstrman)
monstrman - 1 (gabe)

No vote - (JKDS)

9 votes to lynch!

Please check for any errors guys, I've missed votes before.

[rong]

Dan, you weren't in the last game so perhaps you don't understand the resentment about MMM. Absolutely no one will or shouldtrust MMM in a crucial spot. If he's a wolf I'm pretty damn sure he will out himself.

The fact that you had Daven as a good lynch and MMM as a likely villager and yet agreed with Daven's point on MMM and want to lynch him instead is ridiculously sketchy. Are you projecting?

Pushing someone else back to the lynch pile but being willing to snap-lynch them later is pretty standard. For instance, if you have someone who is theoretically seer-hunt cleared yet is still alive in 2 days, you probably need to turbo lynch him. If someone who regularly gets nommed N1 is alive on D5, he probably needs to die. Acting like you don't understand this concept is mind-blowing.

And if you think I'm a wolf you frankly haven't read a damn thing I've posted so far.

The examples you gave have no relevance to the point I made whatsoever, you seem to be deliberately misinterpreting.

[Luco]

post 366


post 373


post 374


yeah, nice reasoning bud.
you are either wolf with mmm or you're a wolf and scared that mmm is cursed.
mmm is close to the lynch, i'm the nearest candidate, and you jump on me with no reasoning. Nice.

I don't think MMM makes that lone wolf post as a full wolf, it's too spewy. I also don't think wolves would be trying to save him if he's cursed, there's no value in it because the guy's a dead duck

And monstr's vote for you is explainable as tit-for-tat, it's neutral at worst

then your post 377 mis-representing what happened with respect to the vote orders. Pretty sure that mmm had a bunch of votes before my wagon even started.

This is fair, MMM hit 7 when you were at 2.

[Hoopy]

Less than 10 hours left of day 1 people!

[gabe]

i think daven has done a fair job defending himself. i think MMM has been kinda scattered and i dont have a good read but he would be a good lynch

ITT monstrman is being honest and wants to tell us all how honest he is

Using words like honest, genuine, legitimate is a wolf tell but here it could just be a style thing as it's so frequent.

i think its a real wolf tell. you cant give him a pass on it because we havent played with him. hes still a human that behaves/posts like one. hes a really solid lynch target now. the points early in day 1 against him i still think are pretty valid

[rong]

Dan, you weren't in the last game so perhaps you don't understand the resentment about MMM. Absolutely no one will or shouldtrust MMM in a crucial spot. If he's a wolf I'm pretty damn sure he will out himself.


The fact that you had Daven as a good lynch and MMM as a likely villager and yet agreed with Daven's point on MMM and want to lynch him instead is ridiculously sketchy. Are you projecting?


wolves make valid points about players too, if they only ever lied and misdirected they'd be rather easy to spot, don't you think? Not to mention it's day 1 and my suspicion is nothing more than that.

Pushing someone else back to the lynch pile but being willing to snap-lynch them later is pretty standard. For instance, if you have someone who is theoretically seer-hunt cleared yet is still alive in 2 days, you probably need to turbo lynch him. If someone who regularly gets nommed N1 is alive on D5, he probably needs to die. Acting like you don't understand this concept is mind-blowing.

you're equating a player with the potential to become a good lynch with someone you've already decided is a definite lynch, that's not even nearly the same thing.

A player you will definitely lynch and who will be an easy definite lynch later is gold for wolves to keep around. They'd sit there waiting for pressure and know they can throw that out there whenever they need to in the knowledge most of the village already agrees. As each day passes we have more info to help deduce the wolves, yet you want to maintain the presence of a stumbling block for later in the game. How you can't see that I just don't understand.

And if you think I'm a wolf you frankly haven't read a damn thing I've posted so far.

considering I'm responding directly to your pro wolf logic and think it's quite clear I have.

.

[Luco]

If you're never letting him get to end game then it's even more reason to lynch him now.

Later on we have far more valuable reads, but you prefer to kill off someone now based on day 1 interaction rather than wait until you have evidence.

Also Daven isn't that easy to kill off. If you're a wolf and both Daven and mmm are villagers it makes far more sense to kill Daven now and leave the easy kill of mmm until later than to do it the other way round.

Solid post. I like point #3 even though it's aimed at baud, if daven & mojo are both V then wolves would want daven down first in this spot

[Luco]

i think daven has done a fair job defending himself. i think MMM has been kinda scattered and i dont have a good read but he would be a good lynch

You've been back and forth on mojo. Why do you say he would be a good lynch?

i think its a real wolf tell. you cant give him a pass on it because we havent played with him. hes still a human that behaves/posts like one. hes a really solid lynch target now. the points early in day 1 against him i still think are pretty valid

You caught gator with exactly this a few games back (during his forever wolf run). What do you think of the evidence baud has produced that shows this is normal and in-character for a monstr villager? Surely that reduces the tell to null?

[Keybored]

You have 4 wolves locked in. Theres only 3 wolves and a cursed villager and the cursed villager (if not MMM) certainly has no clue whether MMM is an outed wolf or a villager. SO why exactly did you say 4 wolves? Is this a POV slip?

In my mind, we're up against 4 wolves.
And to quote myself: "The 4 Wolves are locked in here: Keith/Daven/Wuf/Aubrey/Rong."
It's d1, so this is obv very loose.

[Keybored]

. . . explain to me how MMM posted his first post the same minute that Hoopy posted the thread. That implies he was sat there refreshing the forum to see the thread and he certainly didn't have time to read the post to find out what roles were playing. Villagers aren't sat there refreshing the thread and insta posting, they read the intro , the rules and what roles the village has.

In the signup thread, Hoopy laid out most of his intentions.
3:41pm -- Hoopy blasts all: "You are villagers. Everyone gets this message, if you don't get another PM you are a villager."
3:58pm -- Hoopy posts #1.
3:58pm -- MMM posts obv silliness.
4:01pm -- Hoopy posts rules.
4:02pm -- Hoopy posts game on.

MMM had 17 minutes to read any PMs he may have gotten; plenty of time.
His first post's timing is a non-issue, he snap voted wearing his "fun" hat.
I caught it early too but gave it no value.

I don't claim to know what a villager does versus what a wolf does in the first seconds of the game.
But I do know that it's in the best interest of a wolf to know exactly what the game setup looks like before posting.
It's also imperative for the wolves to make den introductions b4 game posting.
Anyone posting in the first 10 minutes of opening gets village lean from me, not wolf.

[Keybored]

this is one hell of a logic fail. Since when is it +ev for the wolves to get rid of a guy who cracks under pressure. Wolves try to take out the specials and/or strong players first not the weak players . DId you read the "discussion" that MMM and I had post game last game. It was fricking obvious to everyone who played last game that MMM would be my first day one lynch vote this game. MMM acknowledges that in his early posts. SInce you want to examine my every word ... Are you being deliberately dense? He's a distraction BECAUSE he tried to pull a move...

You have 4 wolves locked in . Theres only 3 wolves and a cursed villager and the cursed villager (if not MMM) certainly has no clue whether MMM is an outed wolf or a villager. SO why exactly did you say 4 wolves?Is this a POV slip?

*I chopped out content above to shorten quote.

Keith's getting emotional folks. Curses, insults, caps in one post. Defending is one thing, blowing up is another.
Someone tell me if this is V or W Keith.

[rong]

That's just Keith.

[OngBonga]

Holy fucking shit. I have a villager read on dan.

doobs, those posts merely show that I'm reading back my posts when submitted, rather than in preview. If I were a noob, this would be a huge villager tell, but I'm experienced enough to do that as a wolf too so it's as null as null gets. But I'm not sure I had literally just inhaled!

[OngBonga]

Oh and whoever asked if I'm going to vote for daven - no.

I think daven is wolfier than mojo. I also could be wrong, and I am also convinced that we will regret leaving mojo around, regardless of his alignment. Dan is pretty much saying the same as me when it comes to why mojo has to go today. Even though daven is wolfier.

[MadMojoMonkey]

Yeah. Keith attacks like a rabid dog, and that's not role indicative to me.

This is my 5th game. I think Keith has aggro'd on me in every game. Something about me just rubs Keith the wrong way. I've never played a W, but he always sees me as wolf. Why Keith? Why you make the same mistake over and over again?

***
baud, Luco, dhubs are the 99% (villagers). Probably key, too.

Less than 99% V:
Probably monstrman, but only because I trust baud is V, and baud is vouching for him.
I like bigred as V, but it'll take a lot more in-game activity from him to tell.

You'd think I'd have a personal mandate to never be fooled by key again after last game, and you'd be right. I'm reading signs that he's not just sheeping the thread and following along... he's not even remotely playing the noob card (which no one would believe after last game anyway). Key deserves to be on equal footing with my other Villager picks, but I just can't bring myself to place a strong opinion on key during D1. Not so soon after he bamboozled me so thoroughly.

***
I don't like the way gabe is tunneling monstrman, but all we have to go on is baud's word for now. I don't like the notion of gunning for a new player on D1. I think we are all better served, regardless of role, to let him show some colors before we lynch. Otherwise, we're stuck in the same position next game he plays. No one will know how to read him since he only posted in 1 game on D1.

His whole, "lol, I forgot" is pretty lynch-worthy, though. It's severely anti-village, even if it's not wolfy.

***
BID is capable of more than he's given us thus far. Same for JKDS. Same for aubrey. Same for ong.

I'm lost for a read on rong.

I feel like wuf has slowly worked himself back to neutral with me.
Will double check.

I'm still happy with my vote on daven.

[OngBonga]

If I had faith in the village to not use mojo's poor d1 later on against him, I'd feel better about lynching daven today. But I don't even have enough faith that I can leave it alone. Mojo feels more like a villager the longer this day goes on. But come d4, if he's still around, I just sense we'll be saying why the fuck didn't we deal with it d1.

[Keybored]

This is retarded thinking, just so you know.

Rong, there were 130 posts btw this one (#482) and you last one (#352).
And this is what you come in with to start your post period?
I appreciate your opinion but everyone's got an asshole.

FWIW...
Suggest you look at what I did from a higher than Level 1 perspective.
Think about it, then examine what came of it. It's called tactics.
Thanks for the love, tho.

[OngBonga]

keyb feels more casual this game. I think.

[OngBonga]

Also, I am loathe to even mention this (for reasons you should be able to figure out) but if Ong randed Cursed here I tend to think he wouldn't play it this way.

Based on this logic, can you see mojo being cursed? I'm thinking maybe he's too obvious. The optimal way to play cursed is reasonably obvious but I'm not gonna say it out loud. What I will say is that when I think about it, mojo has not played in the way that I would consider to be optimal for cursed.

[OngBonga]

rescind

[Keith]

In the signup thread, Hoopy laid out most of his intentions.
3:41pm -- Hoopy blasts all: "You are villagers. Everyone gets this message, if you don't get another PM you are a villager."
3:58pm -- Hoopy posts #1.
3:58pm -- MMM posts obv silliness.
4:01pm -- Hoopy posts rules.
4:02pm -- Hoopy posts game on.

MMM had 17 minutes to read any PMs he may have gotten; plenty of time.
His first post's timing is a non-issue, he snap voted wearing his "fun" hat.
I caught it early too but gave it no value.

I don't claim to know what a villager does versus what a wolf does in the first seconds of the game.
But I do know that it's in the best interest of a wolf to know exactly what the game setup looks like before posting.
It's also imperative for the wolves to make den introductions b4 game posting.
Anyone posting in the first 10 minutes of opening gets village lean from me, not wolf.

this is a total non post but shows up contradictions.you are saying that a wolf knows the rules and setup before posting but you claim that his first post was obvious silliness. if its obvious silliness then the game setup and rules make no difference , its not role indicative. You show the time difference between the villager PM and the thread being posted and say that it is imperative that a wolf make den intros before posting. How do you know that he hadn't already posted in the wolf den. Only Hoopy and the wolves know when the wolf PMs were sent out. In previous game discussions the idea has been floated that wolves would get their pms early so that they get some preparation time. How do you know that this didn't happen this time?.

and the biggest contradiction is you giving a villager lean to someone posting in the first 10 minutes. Lets see if you meant it.
using your #332

MMM <> *BAUDIB* <> 2 ................Bud : 1
BAUDIB <> DAVEN <> 11 ...............Bud : 1 Dav 1
MMM <> *ONG* <> 14 ...................Dav 1 : ong 1
WUF <> *DHUBER* <> 17...............Dav 1 : ong 1 : dhub 1
KEITH <> MMM <> 29 .....................Dav 1 : ong 1 : dhub 1 :MMM 1
MMM <> *DHUBER* <> 39 ..............Dav 1 : ong 1 : dhub 2 :MMM 1
MMM <> WUF <> 42 .......................Dav 1 : ong 1 : dhub 1 :MMM 1 : WUF 1
WUF <> MMM <> 43 .......................Dav 1 : ong 1 : dhub 1 :MMM 2 :WUF 1
DHUBER <> *MMM* <> 48 ..............Dav 1 : ong 1 : dhub 1 :MMM 3 :WUF 1
DAVEN <> *DHUBER* <> 54 ...........Dav 1 : ong 1 : dhub 2 :MMM 3 :WUF 1
KEYB <> *MMM* <> 60 ...................Dav 1 : ong 1 : dhub 2 :MMM 4 :WUF 1
GABE <> MONSTR <> 63..................Dav 1 : ong 1 : dhub 2 :MMM 4 :WUF 1 : MON 1
ONG <> *BIGRED* <> 100...............Dav 1 : ong 1 : dhub 2 :MMM 4 :WUF 1 : MON 1 BRed 1
KEYB <> DAVEN <> 177...................Dav 2 : ong 1 : dhub 2 :MMM 3 :WUF 1 : MON 1 BRed 1
DAVEN <> WUF <> 192....................Dav 2 : ong 1 : dhub 1 :MMM 3 :WUF 2 : MON 1 BRed 1
RONG <> MMM <> 194.....................Dav 2 : ong 1 : dhub 1 :MMM 4 :WUF 2 : MON 1 BRed 1
DHUBER <> MMM <> 221.................Dav 2 : ong 1 : dhub 1 :MMM 4 :WUF 2 : MON 1 BRed 1 dhuber already on MMM
BIGRED <> AUBREY <> 225..............Dav 2 : ong 1 : dhub 1 :MMM 4 :WUF 2 : MON 1 BRed 1 AUB 1
AUBREY <> MMM <> 241..................Dav 2 : ong 1 : dhub 1 :MMM 5 :WUF 2 : MON 1 BRed 1 AUB 1
BID <> MMM <> 242.........................Dav 2 : ong 1 : dhub 1 :MMM 6 :WUF 2 : MON 1 BRed 1 AUB 1
ONG <> MMM <> 280.......................Dav 2 : ong 1 : dhub 1 :MMM 7 :WUF 2 : MON 1 AUB 1
LUCO <> DAVEN <> 284...................Dav 3 : ong 1 : dhub 1 :MMM 7 :WUF 2 : MON 1 AUB 1

do you remember #36

Yup...MoMo doing a 180 on us and it makes my ass twitch. Also agree with Keith's suspicion re snap play and excited role hijinks. MMM looking rough early, representing too strong a hand IMO.

thats not what you are claiming now.

also post #60 ...remember the one where you vote for MMM by quoting wuf

Originally Posted by wufwugyYour responses so far are things I've seen smart people who are new at wolfing do. rescind d-mex lanch mmm

Lynch MadMoMo and his popcorn.

Sheesh...

no explanation except the inference by quoting that you agree with wuf.

now your latest theory is

First wolf to cry out, folks.

Keith, I'm not campaigning for an "alternate" to MoMo. I'm saying MoMo's not a wolf and my vote is better off sitting on someone who IS wolfy. I'm NOT voting for someone who is "likely" to be a distraction later. Your "if" he get's lynched and "then" comes back to (potentially) flip "cursed" statement is super weak and not to your usual standard. You speak very seldom and very little, so every word has to be "examined" closely. Therefore, here's my read: Wolf Keith started the MoMo lynch D1 thinking it's a free wolf kill with absolutely no backlash. If I was a wolf, it woulda been my first vote, no question. Keith, I'm not stalling. I'm saying you motivated the wolves to pounce on the weakest known player and you made the first vote along that line.

look who voted for MMM early me , wuf dhuber and you. I'm supposed to be making it so that the wolves can pounce on the weakest player. then you post this

So what yer saying Aubrey, is...
...after I outed 2-3 wolves sitting on the easy MMM wagon...
...where I asked Dhuber and BID to jump ship to the Daven wagon to expose them baddies...
...after I outed Keith for starting the weak wolf MMM wagon...
...and then Daven flailed about like a landed fish...
...which left which wolves exposed on the MMM wagon??
Oh yah...Wuf & Rong & Aubrey & Ong, sitting in a tree: K-I-S-S-I-N-G.

SOULREAD: The 4 Wolves are locked in here: Keith/Daven/Wuf/Aubrey/Rong.

Col Mustard/In the Library/with the Lead Pipe
Envelope please.

so of those early MMM voters that you say are the wolves that i'm supposed to be leading the way for them to pounce on MMM, dhuber isn't in your list of wolves , wuf is and you aren't. Those are the MMM voters in the first 60 posts . THen there's 130+ posts before rong and aubrey and ong vote for him. If this is the wolf plan as you claim why does it take so long for rong aubrey and ong to get onto MMM,and why is daven sat on wuf in your list of votes.This shows how far fetched your theory is.
When the evidence doesn't fit your theory , even MMM can tell you from his scientific background that there is something wrong with your theory.You are contradicting yourself, making arguments to fit your accusations rather than looking at the evidence and seeing if it fits your argument. You are trying to target the better players ( look at how modest i am), you aren't addressing points made about you ,and you're just acting the classroom snitch running up to teacher saying .....oooo keith said naughty words to me , punish him. . I think you're a wolf.

rescind MMM lynch Keybored

[OngBonga]

BID is capable of more than he's given us thus far. Same for JKDS. Same for aubrey. Same for ong.

Here's what you can expect me not to do this game - multiple rereads. I'll find plenty of time to engage with people, but I'm much less willing to put in 2-3 hours shifts reading the pissing thread. That's what took it out of me last game - constantly having to do what I think people expect me to do as villager. Well this game I'm doing what I want, because I don't care what people expect of me. I probably make this adjustment regardless of my alignment, so I'm not asking for village cred here. I'm simply saying don't be surprised if I fail to meet your expectations of villager ong.

[monstrman]

i think daven has done a fair job defending himself. i think MMM has been kinda scattered and i dont have a good read but he would be a good lynch


i think its a real wolf tell. you cant give him a pass on it because we havent played with him. hes still a human that behaves/posts like one. hes a really solid lynch target now. the points early in day 1 against him i still think are pretty valid

"I think the tell that was just proven to be something he says in both alignments is still a wolf tell" how do you even believe what you are saying?

Yes I'm still a human and still act and behave like one, hence when I am in a game I act according to the same mannerisms regardless of my aligment.

"Monstrman uses those words in both alignments, but is still a viable lynch target because that's a wolf tell" isn't a line of thought that even remotely makes sense.

[aubreymcfate]

i went over daven's posts last night and agreed with dhuber (i think it was) who said he reeked of agenda

i also agree with keith about keybored's post #60 when he lynches MMM with little to no reason. that was very early in the game, and followed the coattails of others coming hard on MMM. it seemed a little opportunistic.

i want to rescind MMM but i can't decide who i would like to put my vote on, it's possible i won't rescind because i am simply pressed for time (leaving tomorrow morning omgz), but those are my thoughts atm

[monstrman]

I feel so gimped because the only solace I have is the threadflow of this game and I have zero meta on any of you.

It's really upsetting because that's how I play.

[monstrman]

But ill be honest. The thread doesn't feel tense. It doesn't feel like anyone is really stressing out about either of these wagons and it just feels like everyone is casually accepting them for what they are, which really concerns me irt the outcome of this day.

[OngBonga]

Our games rarely get tense. People sometimes bitch about getting lynched, but I see many more tantrums and bicking on other sites.

[OngBonga]

*bickering

[MadMojoMonkey]

Someone tell me if this is V or W Keith.

It's not role-indicative.

Kieth's tone made my lady cry multiple times in a discussion about veganism. I'm not holding anything against Keith for her getting butthurt over some internet conversation that she kept injecting herself into. I counseled her as much at the time. (Also, I think veganism is stupid, so - yeah.)

[aubreymcfate]

It's not role-indicative.

Kieth's tone made my lady cry multiple times in a discussion about veganism. I'm not holding anything against Keith for her getting butthurt over some internet conversation that she kept injecting herself into. I counseled her as much at the time. (Also, I think veganism is stupid, so - yeah.)

now i understand why you are so sympathetic to me on random thread hahaha

except i dont cry, my hair just turns into snakes and eats everyone

[OngBonga]

mojo was at L-1 for a while and didn't get hammered. If mojo isn't a wolf, then that strongly implies that daven isn't a wolf either. daven is close enough to mojo that if daven is a wolf and mojo not, then mojo would surely be dead by now.

[rong]

Ong, rescinding mmm is practically bolding Daven at this point in the day.

[OngBonga]

What we need is a totally random new lynch.

lynch drew

[OngBonga]

Ong, rescinding mmm is practically bolding Daven at this point in the day.

Maybe. If I'm forced to choose between daven and mojo, I'll make a decision. Let's see what else happens. How long is left? A few hours?

[MadMojoMonkey]

Here's what you can expect me not to do this game - multiple rereads. I'll find plenty of time to engage with people, but I'm much less willing to put in 2-3 hours shifts reading the pissing thread. That's what took it out of me last game - constantly having to do what I think people expect me to do as villager. Well this game I'm doing what I want, because I don't care what people expect of me. I probably make this adjustment regardless of my alignment, so I'm not asking for village cred here. I'm simply saying don't be surprised if I fail to meet your expectations of villager ong.

and I'm simply saying that this post is neither funny, nor does it provide your insight. It's just self preservation.

[OngBonga]

I think it's 10pm uk, which is just under 5 hrs.

[MadMojoMonkey]

mojo was at L-1 for a while and didn't get hammered. If mojo isn't a wolf, then that strongly implies that daven isn't a wolf either. daven is close enough to mojo that if daven is a wolf and mojo not, then mojo would surely be dead by now.

:/
Yeah. I thought this before I went to bed. I'm not sure how to deal with this thought.

Village points to you.

[OngBonga]

and I'm simply saying that this post is neither funny, nor does it provide your insight. It's just self preservation.

[MadMojoMonkey]

What we need is a totally random new lynch.

Screw you, ong.

ong -> <- MMM

[rong]

I have no idea what that little violin and arrows thing means. I'm starting to feel old though.

[MadMojoMonkey]

Don't bring my cocaine (Michael Cain) into this.

[MadMojoMonkey]

I have no idea what that little violin and arrows thing means. I'm starting to feel old though.

Means he's playing me like a fiddle.

[OngBonga]

Oh is that what it means? I thought it was supposed to indicate that me and you are stood there with a violinist between us. I thought it was like a heart or something. I thought you were being a bit gay for me.

[MadMojoMonkey]

OK, I see. The only thing I can do if we believe that the implication is that MMM/daven is V-V is to move off of daven.

There's plenty of time for shenanigans in the next 4.5 hours.

ong has clearly sided to protect daven.

I'm OK with a BID lynch, obv.

:/

I need a deep breath.

@baud, dhubs, key, Luco:
what are you thinking about this vote analysis?

[Luco]

Oh is that what it means? I thought it was supposed to indicate that me and you are stood there with a violinist between us. I thought it was like a heart or something. I thought you were being a bit gay for me.

I thought it meant you were unsympathetic or something? like the phrase 'playing this violin just for you'

[MadMojoMonkey]

Who said I'm not a bit gay for you?

[OngBonga]

ong has clearly sided to protect daven.

For today I think so. I feel the same about daven as I do JKDS... too strong to kill off on d1 thanks to gut alone. If It's looking like you or daven, I'll probably get back on you.

[MadMojoMonkey]

Sheez, you guys are so unhip it's amazing your bums don't fall off.

(I award 5 internets to the first person to cite that quote.)

[OngBonga]

Who said I'm not a bit gay for you?

*awkward laughter*

[rong]

I imagine I'm alone but I'd enjoy lynching baudib.

[wufwugy]

TBH I just skimmed over the last two pages. I feel like we're doing way too much. We already have way more than enough to kill MMM and Daven. Half of us fully agree on why MMM has to die (no MMM I haven't pulled back on you, I think you're very likely to be cursed, you're acting exactly as I would predict a caught cursed to act), and Daven is a dead wolf walking

I think we're getting far ahead of ourselves. We need to make those two deaths happen (or clear them by making strong cases for why they're bad lynches, which nobody has done) before we move on to others


My only other comment is that I caught the same thing Luco did about Monstr. It almost looks like he's a wolf giving his suspected cursed pick motivation to fight back. He is absolutely right about villagers being the only people who know their role so they need to fight (I've made that argument several times), but that argument is weird when it's directed outwards. In that post, he basically said "hey MMM I think you're a villager so you should fight fight fight and get people off you". Hell, he may even have said it about Daven as well. The reason it's so strange to direct at others that when villagers don't defend themselves, it should tell us that hey maybe they're not villagers. This could be Monstr accidentally using his special knowledge of roles

So let's kill MMM today, then spend 1 hour in d2 piling on Daven, then spend d3 discussing the next step. Ofc I don't expect everybody to agree with me, but I agree with myself, so there


BTW even though I just skimmed the latest posts (I do that from time to time), I still go back over them deeply when I'm trying to find something/make a case. I've greatly increased the amount of my game is going back over old stuff, and I guess that's part of why I have cut down on my text. It's harrowing to review previous posts when so much of it is fluff

[OngBonga]

Sheez, you guys are so unhip it's amazing your bums don't fall off.

(I award 5 internets to the first person to cite that quote.)

Oh did I miss a reference?

[OngBonga]

lynch wuf

[wufwugy]

lynch wuf

Bold me when you an ounce of evidence that I'm not proposing pro-village policy

[OngBonga]

So let's kill MMM today, then spend 1 hour in d2 piling on Daven, then spend d3 discussing the next step. Ofc I don't expect everybody to agree with me, but I agree with myself, so there

This is the least pro village thing I've seen posted so far.

[MadMojoMonkey]

@ wuf re: monstr
I read (past tense, for clarity) it as culture shock.

[wufwugy]

Seriously, under what circumstances would a wolf ever be against letting the village move off wagons for no reason? If I'm a wolf, the last thing I do is stop you guys from debolding MMM and Daven. Wolves adore mess. The more the village confuses itself, the more likely the wolves win

Ong it was just yesterday you made a succinct post about how Daven must have caught wolf. Virtually nothing has changed since then, yet you wish to bold me instead of Daven? You wish to bold me instead MMM, who you made the perfect case for why should be the first lynch and nothing has changed

Villagers do best when they don't fool themselves

[wufwugy]

This is the least pro village thing I've seen posted so far.

False. Stop creating confusion

[baudib]

i think daven has done a fair job defending himself. i think MMM has been kinda scattered and i dont have a good read but he would be a good lynch


i think its a real wolf tell. you cant give him a pass on it because we havent played with him. hes still a human that behaves/posts like one. hes a really solid lynch target now. the points early in day 1 against him i still think are pretty valid

Gabe, what exactly are you doing this game? Almost every post you make makes my eyebrows twitch.

There's so much that read like your past couple of wolf.

"Hey, we have to lynch the new guy because we won't be able to read him." Then you make a surface read of a couple of posts and declare you have read him.

This sounds like more policy-lynching and while I've seen you make some whimsical votes on D1, this is nothing at all when you were making votes on me and Keybored last game as a villager. It sounds more like "Hey guys, we can't have all these duck names around, I'm telling you it'll be confusing." And as you pointed out, the Gabe name carries more weight, so you can try to push more B.S.

We've had a lot of newcomers in the past few games, and I don't remember you ever expressing this idea that it's +EV to just policy lynch them.

wuf my soul read credits have only gone up this year.. however im a bad wolf, a terrible ghost angel, and my success rate at convincing the village to kill someone i read when i die is 0% (props to gator and ong recently for escaping my deathrattle)

You trying to sell the notion that you're a bad wolf is...weird. Also, the phrase is not wolfy in itself but I remember you saying, meh, BigRed is an +EV lynch...when you were a wolf. Then you pointed out how sometimes you can find dissonance in players' thinking...the last time I recall you using "dissonance" in an argument was you putting together a couple of Gator quotes and saying, "Dissonance is a wolfy trait."

yeah, you were a wolf that game, too.

[wufwugy]

The fucking LAST place we want to be on d2 is one where both MMM and Daven are alive. The cases against them are waaaaaaaaaay better than everybody else, yet you propose we don't lynch them? Do you even know how to village?

[OngBonga]

TBH I just skimmed over the last two pages.

Ong it was just yesterday you made a succinct post about how Daven must have caught wolf. Virtually nothing has changed since then,

How do you know nothing has changed since then?

Why, if daven is a wolf, is mojo not dead?